Does God exist?

[goku]

Life can indeed come from non life, as long as the conditions are correct and established life isn't around to supress the process. Life is as inevitable as the result of mixing hydrogen with oxygen is inevitable. When the conditions are right for a long enough period of time life will develope. It works that way for all stages of life as well. Resistance is futile:doh:

 

and i'm the one accused of being blind, ignorant, close minded, crazy, so forth and so on :shrug:

[Moontanman]

and i'm the one accused of being blind, ignorant, close minded, crazy, so forth and so on :shrug:

 

I would never say any of those things about you, but be careful we humans have a tendency to ascribe our own faults to others we disagree with in order to demonize them. :doh:

[modest]

oh, evidence, life comes from life.

any scientist knows that.

 

Scientifically, I would say that isn't proven.

Logically, I'd say that statement isn't a proof for God.

Personally, I'd disagree with your statement.

Theologically, I'd add that Ecclesiastes 3:20 disagrees with you.

 

-modest

[UncleAl]

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence.

 

1) Belousov-Zhabotinsky reaction: No watchmaker required to bring forth the watch

2) Hindus have 36 crore of gods - 360 million deities. How is India doing? Test of faith! Why does the Pope need secular security? Where is his faith?

3) In the whole of human history across the entire planet not one deity has volunteered Novocain. It is a telling omission.

4) Can God make a collection plate so vast that even He cannot fill it? Sure! ALL OF THEM. Take the hint.

[HydrogenBond]

If look at God as an abstract concept, it expresses all the extremes into one 3-D concept, such as infinity-point, matter-energy, male-female, good-evil, etc. The concept of mathematical infinity probably resulted from contemplation of God as applied to physical dimension. Like God, infinity can not be proven. What both represent are abstract anchors for the mind, that help humans think beyond the finite and go beyond finite limits. If we required math to prove infinity existed before it could use it, this would mess up math. Instead it would have to use a finite number that can be proven. Relative to the mind, infinity pushes us better. The other way around we would be satisfied with 0.00001% more. With infinity we think in terms of doubling that limit since it is still small for infinity.

 

If you look at religion, it often reflects the extremes in terms of some of the historical evil, but also the self sacrifice, the motivation, etc. This is because the 3-D anchor at infinity, which extends beyond numbers, causes people to push beyond their finite limits. In modern times, the infinite God abstract is often reduced to a personification. If it is just a person, the anchor is very limited and many atheists see little use for it. But if it is placed at infinity the affect is different.

 

Let me give a practical example. It is like comparing two students out of high school. One is thinking with a four year plan and the other with a one month plan. The one with the longer plan is willing to sacrifice some of their fun and go to college. The one with the one month plan will prefer work, make money and have fun. Based on the position of their time abstract they act accordingly. If we look in terms of evolution or a time abstract that goes beyond themselves, who ends up making the best decisions for the real long haul. The atheist lost their infinity anchor for anything beyond math and science. This will do well as long as they keep ay least this anchor.

[goku]

i can not make anyone know or believe God,

 

but if there is any thing i say that makes sense or brings forth good, it did not come from me. it came from God.

 

if there is falt in anything i say, that is of me.

[Moontanman]

i can not make anyone know or believe God,

 

but if there is any thing i say that makes sense or brings forth good, it did not come from me. it came from God.

 

if there is falt in anything i say, that is of me.

 

Then why do you bother to discuss something you have no intention of ever seeing as the truth? For fun? To change my mind? Good luck I have seen the light and I took a good look.

[goku]

Then why do you bother to discuss something you have no intention of ever seeing as the truth? For fun? To change my mind? Good luck I have seen the light and I took a good look.

 

for better understanding, to give proof of a better way, and to do as i'm told

[Moontanman]

for better understanding, to give proof of a better way, and to do as i'm told

 

So far all you have done is do as you were told, your attitude is very disrespectful. You have been handled with kid gloves but you don't return the favor. I see no reason to contue to treat you as true seaker of anything other than your own agenda.

[goku]

So far all you have done is do as you were told, your attitude is very disrespectful. You have been handled with kid gloves but you don't return the favor. I see no reason to contue to treat you as true seaker of anything other than your own agenda.

 

:confused:

disrespectful?

kid gloves?

:hihi:

[REASON]

i can not make anyone know or believe God,

 

but if there is any thing i say that makes sense or brings forth good, it did not come from me. it came from God.

 

if there is falt in anything i say, that is of me.

 

So you're unwilling to take personal credit for any of the goodness that comes of you, but you accept all the blame for your failings.

 

The truth is that you are in control of your life and will make choices as you see fit.

 

In our lives, each of us is capable of many forms of expression, and we learn how to use them as we go through our individual experiences. At some point in our lives we will likely have experienced the full complement of our emotional reactions to situations, from expressions of caring, kindness, and love, to fear, hatred, and anger.

 

This is what it means to be a human being.

 

I have, and will continue, to express these ranges of emotions and reactions, yet I don't share your confidence in the reality of God. In your eyes, does the goodness I bring forth come from God? Can I be a vessel of God's love and good will even though I have not established belief in him? If so, than belief in God is not required to receive and spread his grace. If not, than where does my goodness emanate from, if not from God?

 

I tend to believe that a person's desire to be caring and good comes from the positive reinforcement that they experience in doing so, particularly when positive reinforcement is what they prefer. Unfortunately for some, negative reinforcement is all they believe exists or think they deserve, and that is what they pursue. These are primarily learned behaviors and based on individual experiences.

[freeztar]

In our lives, each of us is capable of many forms of expression, and we learn how to use them as we go through our individual experiences. At some point in our lives we will likely have experienced the full complement of our emotional reactions to situations, from expressions of caring, kindness, and love, to fear, hatred, and anger.

 

This is what it means to be a human being.

 

I have, and will continue, to express these ranges of emotions and reactions, yet I don't share your confidence in the reality of God. In your eyes, does the goodness I bring forth come from God? Can I be a vessel of God's love and good will even though I have not established belief in him? If so, then belief in God is not required to receive and spread his grace. If not, then where does my goodness emanate from, if not from God?

 

I tend to believe that a person's desire to be caring and good comes from the positive reinforcement that they experience in doing so. Particularly when positive reinforcement is what they prefer. Unfortunately for some, negative reinforcement is all they believe exists or think they deserve, and that is what they pursue. These are primarily learned behaviors and based on individual experiences.

 

:hihi: :confused:

[jedaisoul]

God is alive, and me as well.

dead is not alive, nor can rocks suddenly start living, it's impossible.

you can't git blood from a turnip.

Life can indeed come from non life, as long as the conditions are correct and established life isn't around to supress the process. Life is as inevitable as the result of mixing hydrogen with oxygen is inevitable. When the conditions are right for a long enough period of time life will develope. It works that way for all stages of life as well. Resistance is futile:doh:

I agree with Moontanman but would like to expand on this reply. When you look at extremes like a rock and, say,a mammal, of course a rock cannot turn into a mammal in one step. Nor did it. In this case, the distinction between life and non-life is clear. But life does not consist of just one property. It is a collection of properties. If you look at some non-living organic chemicals they possess some, but not all, the properties of life. So in reality the distinction is blurred and arbitrary. We say things are alive if they have all the properties of life, but that they are not if they only have some, or none, of the properties of a living creature.

 

Having established that the division between life and non-life is not as clear cut as it may appear, it is reasonable to assume that, on many occasions, simple living creatures have developed from, technically, non-living chemicals. It's a matter of mixing the right chemicals in the right circumstances and allowing enough time. Note: I'm not talking about a mammal appearing from a chemical goo. I'm talking about the very simplest microscopic organisms.

 

That given, the rest is just evolution.

[goku]

So you're unwilling to take personal credit for any of the goodness that comes of you, but you accept all the blame for your failings.

 

The truth is that you are in control of your life and will make choices as you see fit.

 

In our lives, each of us is capable of many forms of expression, and we learn how to use them as we go through our individual experiences. At some point in our lives we will likely have experienced the full complement of our emotional reactions to situations, from expressions of caring, kindness, and love, to fear, hatred, and anger.

 

This is what it means to be a human being.

 

I have, and will continue, to express these ranges of emotions and reactions, yet I don't share your confidence in the reality of God. In your eyes, does the goodness I bring forth come from God? Can I be a vessel of God's love and good will even though I have not established belief in him? If so, than belief in God is not required to receive and spread his grace. If not, than where does my goodness emanate from, if not from God?

 

I tend to believe that a person's desire to be caring and good comes from the positive reinforcement that they experience in doing so, particularly when positive reinforcement is what they prefer. Unfortunately for some, negative reinforcement is all they believe exists or think they deserve, and that is what they pursue. These are primarily learned behaviors and based on individual experiences.

 

the only, control i have over my life is what choice to make.

 

all goodness is of God, the bible says "a form of Godlyness" meaning people will try to do good.

[REASON]

the only, control i have over my life is what choice to make.

 

Virtually everything you do, whether good, bad, or indifferent, involves a choice you make.

 

all goodness is of God, the bible says "a form of Godlyness" meaning people will try to do good.

 

In reality, you usually don't have to look very far to find people that do not try to do good, even as they claim to have a relationship with God. Often, claiming allegiance with God and the Bible is really more about creating an image than it is about establishing a pattern of behavior. These situations are also indicative of individual choice.

 

No matter what the Bible says, Godliness does not guarantee goodness in human behavior. Horrible, vile, inhuman acts have been perpetrated in God's name by righteous people throughout history, and are still occurring today with no interference by God.

[modest]

all goodness is of God,

 

By your beliefs: so is all evil.

 

the bible says "a form of Godlyness" meaning people will try to do good.

 

The bible also says "All things were made by Him" Evil, sadism, sin, depravity and indecency and everything else - all came from God. You think God just wants credit for the good things? When he strikes a child dead with lightning you think he doesn't want credit for that?

 

I think he does. After all, bible says: "God is a jealous God". Giving Satan the credit for evil when its something God came up with may make God jealous.

 

-modest

[jedaisoul]

When he strikes a child dead with lightning you think he doesn't want credit for that? I think he does. After all, bible says: "God is a jealous God". Giving Satan the credit for evil when its something God came up with may make God jealous.

But, on the other hand, God created Satan. So perhaps He wants Satan to take the flack for all the evil that He has done, so He can just take the credit for all the good things?