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17Robots Fulldive Vr Company

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#69 Loney

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Posted 19 June 2015 - 09:41 AM

Well yes ofc coz while ago even pc was more sci fi :D thats why there isnt boundaries for make something most important is target.

#70 17robots

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Posted 19 June 2015 - 10:36 AM

Well yes ofc coz while ago even pc was more sci fi :D thats why there isnt boundaries for make something most important is target.

I agree. We always want to think positive. Think that we can do this, not that it is just science fiction. I feel that each generation is more genious-y than the next, so I feel that it is possible, especially with how fast technology is advancing.



#71 17robots

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Posted 19 June 2015 - 01:00 PM

I think to begin, we need to have a place where we can come together and keep everything that we do. I was thinking a website maybe?



#72 palgonistar12

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Posted 19 June 2015 - 03:30 PM

Hello , I will join to your company , and I will try to help the best way what I can.I am a Polish high school student ICT. I'm 17 years old, almost 18. I watch this forum for half a year and I can see the development of this project. I know about biology, a little on chemistry, computer science (average programming and game development), on electronics, data and signal transmission. Maybe I mentioned quite a lot and not all have mastered to perfection but I think I'll be able to help with the Fulldive Vr system.And sorry for my english, because it is not the best. I learn it but I'm doing it poorly.

And now:
@17robots website is a good idea , but open forum is better for new people , who will help us probably.



#73 17robots

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Posted 19 June 2015 - 04:02 PM

Hello , I will join to your company , and I will try to help the best way what I can.I am a Polish high school student ICT. I'm 17 years old, almost 18. I watch this forum for half a year and I can see the development of this project. I know about biology, a little on chemistry, computer science (average programming and game development), on electronics, data and signal transmission. Maybe I mentioned quite a lot and not all have mastered to perfection but I think I'll be able to help with the Fulldive Vr system.And sorry for my english, because it is not the best. I learn it but I'm doing it poorly.

And now:
@17robots website is a good idea , but open forum is better for new people , who will help us probably.

That is really great to have you on board. I need all the help I can get, and it's great that you want to help out. The only reason I wanted to have a website was so that we could share files and such and not have to risk people steal our stuff.

 

I feel that you would be a great addition to our team with your set of skills. Right now, we are in the phase of mapping out the brain and figuring out how we are going to write to the brain and such. The theory that we want to try is using the nervous system because it seems to be a safer way with less risks. We only need research t back it up. If you could, we are all trying to research stuff, help with that and give us what you find. Anything relevant would be extremely useful to us and our end goal, so if you find anything from periodicals to abstracts to your own intuition, we would gladly use it.



#74 CraigD

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Posted 19 June 2015 - 06:44 PM

So is there anyway to make the writing to the brain any better with TMS? And is TMS noninvasive?

Implanted electrodes and laser links with optogenetically altered neurons allow both reading and writing on as fine a resolution as individual neurons. TMS can only write with a resolution on the order of 1000000000 neurons. As the linked to articles explain, TMS is noninvasive.

fMRI can read with about 1000 times better resolution than TMS can write, but that’s still only on the order of 1000000 neurons.

In short, no noninvasive technology can approach the resolution necessary for a BCI capable of doing what the fictional NerveGear and Amusphere are shown doing.

My hope is that invasive methods can realize something much like the NerveGear by miniaturizing their intrusive parts beyond detectability, and miniaturized computer positioning systems can allow them to implant and unimplant themselves so quickly that it appears the visible device is simply being turned on and off. We discussed this in a series of posts starting here.

Most or all of the questions you’ve asked in this topic (thread), 17robots, have been discussed at length in this subforum. I recommend you read the old topics, following links as deeply as you can. The “hypo” in Hypography stands for hyperlink – it’s important to follow them, and make lots of them in your posts.

I've struggled and will continue to strive to make the old threads more readable by splitting off-topic posts into other threads – everyone can help by starting new threads when they want to branch off-topic, and if you want existing topics spit up, just posting requests for us moderators to do so.
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#75 17robots

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Posted 19 June 2015 - 07:06 PM

What makes it so that the noninvasive tech isn't as precise as the invasive tech? @CraigD



#76 17robots

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Posted 20 June 2015 - 09:50 AM

What about ultrasound? Have any of you guys looked into that?



#77 CraigD

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Posted 20 June 2015 - 11:35 AM

What makes it so that the noninvasive tech isn't as precise as the invasive tech? @CraigD

The fundamental reason noninvasive systems are less precise than invasive ones is because the parts of non-invasive systems are much further away from what they need to measure and affect.

Compounding this is that what needs to measured and affected – nerve tissue – is hard to image with much precision with EM radiation (microwaves, visible light, x-rays, etc) because it and the tissues around it are all about the same density and composition, and has about the same electrical conductivity.

What all this means is that the only way to detect and affect the activity of a single neuron is to either touch it with an electric conductor – an electrode. Optogenetics provide an amazing alternative approach where beams of visible laser light can be used to both measure and affect individual neuron activity, but takes a lot of preparation – you’ve got to genetically alter the neruons, and cut a hole and install a window to allow the laser light to reach them – so while this technology will likely be very valuable researching neurology, I can’t imagine using it for a consumer product.
 

What about ultrasound? Have any of you guys looked into that?

Ultrasound imaging has a maximum resolution of about 0.0001 m. This is about the same as MRI. It could, in principle, image a large individual neuron. Ultrasound can’t image nerve activity, though, because the features that could show it are much smaller, on the scale of a few molecules. Also, ultrasound can’t penetrate bone, so to image the brain with it, you’d have to cut a hole in the skull.

Other than specialized sensory nerves, nerves don’t respond to sound, so ultrasound can’t “write” to nerves at all.

#78 17robots

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Posted 20 June 2015 - 12:59 PM

Ahh, I see. It makes sense though. What if we make the electrodes smaller? Could that potentially make it more precise?



#79 Loney

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Posted 20 June 2015 - 03:16 PM

So awful that i cant help with bran and nerves>< :D sorry 17robots im programmer><

But will try to help with security questions and when it will come to device stuff^^

#80 17robots

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Posted 20 June 2015 - 03:27 PM

So awful that i cant help with bran and nerves>< :D sorry 17robots im programmer><

 

But will try to help with security questions and when it will come to device stuff^^

 

Thats ok Loney, when it comes time to build the device, you will totally be the one asked all of the questions. You can still look up stuff and help with the discussion. What language(s) do you know @Loney? Are you good with operating systems, or arduino, or anything along those lines? What about software development, is that anything you have experience in? And finally, what about web development?



#81 TheSoloPlayer

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Posted 20 June 2015 - 06:53 PM

 I am a bit into web development... But I have forgotten a lot of PHP from about a year ago when I was trying to make a social network before my laptop broke... I can relearn via http://www.codecademy.com/ ... I am mainly a game developer and a learner so I'll get back to you as soon as I can... I use Unity3d 5 to program... Also before my laptop broke I was learning c++ to game program from scratch... I am a bit on again off again...

 

 Also thinking about it, does anybody know if the brainstem can transmit data to the brain via nerves and neurons? If so we can focus on sending data through the brainstem and set specifics in the code so the main neuronal connection will know to which connection we need to send data to such as sight and hearing? We can access it in several ways, but one way I'm thinking about is sticking a needle in the back of the device so when you put on the device, the needle will pierce the skin and control your body such as sending painkillers and "shutting down" the body.


Edited by TheSoloPlayer, 20 June 2015 - 06:57 PM.


#82 17robots

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Posted 20 June 2015 - 06:58 PM

 I am a bit into web development... But I have forgotten a lot of PHP from about a year ago when I was trying to make a social network before my laptop broke... I can relearn via http://www.codecademy.com/ ... I am mainly a game developer and a learner so I'll get back to you as soon as I can... I use Unity3d 5 to program... Also before my laptop broke I was learning c++ to game program from scratch... I am a bit on again off again...

 

 Also thinking about it, does anybody know if the brainstem can transmit data to the brain via nerves and neurons? If so we can focus on sending data through the brainstem and set specifics in the code so the main neuronal connection will know to which connection we need to send data to such as sight and hearing? We can access it in several ways, but one way I'm thinking about is sticking a needle in the back of the device so when you put on the device, the needle will pierce the skin and control your body such as sending painkillers and "shutting down" the body.

I see.I have used codecademy before and I loved it. It is nice. How experienced are you in c++? Do you know anything pertaining to software development? Unity 3d 5 is nice. Does that mean that you are good with c# or are you good with javascript?

 

Interesting idea with the brainstem. I like how you are thinking. Here is a picture of the brainstem and it nerves:

da7c44ff2.gif.pngThe only thing is the needle. Is there a way we could do that noninvasively without the needle?


Edited by 17robots, 20 June 2015 - 07:33 PM.


#83 TheSoloPlayer

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Posted 20 June 2015 - 08:00 PM

 I have forgotten entirely by this point about c++. I do not know much about software development, but I do know you would need to use a high level program such as assembly, C++, C#, C, and others. I am good with javascript... Like I said, after about a year ( the guy didn't even mention about the laptop or fix it for a year ) we got the computer back, still not fixed, send it to another guy, in about a couple of weeks we get it. Before I was at intermediate level, but now I have had to start from the beginning. I am still thinking about joining or not, but like I said, I am quiet on again off again.



#84 17robots

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Posted 20 June 2015 - 08:23 PM

 I have forgotten entirely by this point about c++. I do not know much about software development, but I do know you would need to use a high level program such as assembly, C++, C#, C, and others. I am good with javascript... Like I said, after about a year ( the guy didn't even mention about the laptop or fix it for a year ) we got the computer back, still not fixed, send it to another guy, in about a couple of weeks we get it. Before I was at intermediate level, but now I have had to start from the beginning. I am still thinking about joining or not, but like I said, I am quiet on again off again.Y

You don't have to join, it is entirely your choice. But, again, it would be better to have a person with your skills and attitude about learning. It sucks to hear about your laptop though. Yeah that  was what I had in mind. I just don't have any idea about software development. If you have anyone who would be interested in this, and is good in any of the above areas, I wouldn't mind having them on the team. And, you don't necessarily have to fill out and join and become an employee of the company to help us with it. I mean, isn't that what you are doing now?



#85 CraigD

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Posted 20 June 2015 - 11:47 PM

What if we make the electrodes smaller? Could that potentially make it more precise?

At about 4 x 10-8 m, present day fine metal wires are already about 10 times thinner than the smallest human neurons, so there’s no need to make them smaller.

What needs improvement is the ease with which electrodes can be placed, and the number of them. My hope is that a kind of nanorobotics can be developed that allows the wires to place themselves, coordinated from a macroscopic sensors and computers (the visible helmet part of the system). Such systems would not only be useful for reading and writing to the brain, but for medical diagnosis and therapy in all parts of the body. For more, see this post, and this thread.



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