IrishEyes Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 Are you suggesting, with certainty, that they can control their condition. I am not suggesting that they not be held accountable for their actions. I do think mental incarceration is more appropriate than penal action if there is a doubt in their ability to control themselves. That itself is a mental defect that is often witnessed in those with compulsive disorders. How many with tendencies of pedophilia might also have a compulsive disorder as well?I fear that my first response would be less than appropriate to post, so I'm gonna wait and think a bit, and come back to this one.Has it been proven categorically that pedophilia is a psychological condition, or a genetic condition? Are pedophiles really born with a gene that attracts them to children? Or is this a social conditioning, that can be overcome with re-conditioning, as suggested by a few others in this thread. I don't know that I've ever seen conclusive evidence for either position, and I was unsuccessful at finding any yesterday. If anyone can find the data that shows it is either genetic or social, please post a link. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tormod Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 On an intellectual level, I might want to agree with you, Dave. But realistically, let someone touch one of my babies, and I can't think of a punishment that would be severe enough. I'm with you. There is the rational side of me that "knows" what to do - and a human side of me that *knows* what to do. Not that any of those options are correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infamous Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 I'm certainly not an authority on any of the medical reasons for this deviant behavior, but I would like to add a few thoughts that come to mind. I for one believe that the pedophile is an individual that is socially underdeveloped. Understand, I'm not making excuses here, anyone involved in such activity should be dealt with through all lawfull means. My point is; I had the unfortunate experience of having gone to school with one of these individuals. No names, but this person was always socially out of place. They always seemed to struggle when it came to adjusting to their social enviornment. I know they were interested in taking a greater part in social activities because we had conversations about the topic. They also seemed inept with the opposite sex and had great difficulity making personal connections. My own feelings about their state of mind is this; After they became adults they were still trying to become part of the school days click. They never seemed to shake the feelings of their social inadequacies. Now that they were adults and had a greater feeling of power they begin to act out their childhood fantasies resulting in the severe damage to their victims. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C1ay Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 Has it been proven categorically that pedophilia is a psychological condition, or a genetic condition? Are pedophiles really born with a gene that attracts them to children? Or is this a social conditioning, that can be overcome with re-conditioning, as suggested by a few others in this thread. I don't know but should they be denied the benefit of a doubt in the meantime? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemo Posted August 29, 2005 Report Share Posted August 29, 2005 Are you suggesting, with certainty, that they can control their condition.Ah, absolutes... I'll forego the legal disclaimer and assume that everyone knows I'm not a psychiatrist and that I've not done clinical research on the subject. Aside from that, however, it occurs to me that the definition of 'success' for a graduate of mental incarceration for this type of circumstance would be that he / she never does it again. After a bit of reflection, I'm pretty sure that would be a relatively good barometer for any criminal incarceration... Anyway, assuming that the point of the rehabilitation is to stop them from repeating their crime, and that they have not been physically impared from making a decision to that end, then yes - at some point it becomes a conscious decision on their part to not engage in that behavior. The problem with this scenario is that the counselling or rehabilitation takes place after the crime; regardless of the timeline - it is a decision. People claim they cannot control their behavior every day "I just lost my temper", or "The 1 gallon jug of chocolate chip cookie dough ice cream just called to me". Ultimately, there is an active decision being made, whether it is to throw the punch or lift the spoon. The decision may not be well reasoned with regard to the consequences (which is where the counselling comes in), but there is an active decision making process at work. You also mention mental defects and compuslive disorders. Again, I'm no expert, but I do have a somewhat "serious" case of ADHD. It's been some time since that diagnosis was made, yet I have to make a concerted effort at least once an hour to simply concentrate on what I'm supposed to be doing. As I've grown, I've learned methods that have helped me deal with my 'defect' such as never getting a window office and listening to classical music instead of contemporary songs that I'd end up singing along to. ADHD is a drop in the bucket compared to full blown Schitzophrenia, but somewhere in the middle there has to be a line of accountability. The amount of time and effort required to generate a relationship with a minor to the point of sexual contact requires considerable premeditation and no small amount of cautionary measures to avoid detection. Regardless of the motivation, I believe that someone who takes *any* measures to avoid detection understands the consequences of their actions and that they are wrong; else they would not be trying to hide the actions. Based upon that reasoning, I find very little maneuvering area for the pedophile to be considered a victim of genetics, environment, or malfunctioning puberty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infamous Posted August 29, 2005 Report Share Posted August 29, 2005 The amount of time and effort required to generate a relationship with a minor to the point of sexual contact requires considerable premeditation and no small amount of cautionary measures to avoid detection. Regardless of the motivation, I believe that someone who takes *any* measures to avoid detection understands the consequences of their actions and that they are wrong; else they would not be trying to hide the actions. Based upon that reasoning, I find very little maneuvering area for the pedophile to be considered a victim of genetics, environment, or malfunctioning puberty.I totally agree with this point nemo, and also, very well written I might add. These facts should leave absolutely no question in anyone's mind as to the culpability of the pediphiles actions. Cold, calculating, premeditated, and utterly degenerate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C1ay Posted August 29, 2005 Report Share Posted August 29, 2005 All very true but I still think there is a percentage of pedophiles that just don't have the mental facilties to really understand right from wrong and control themselves. They belong in a mental institution instead of a penal facility. I also believe all of them should be sent to a mental institution for life or exiled for life since the quantity of repeat offenders alone is proof that we do not have the knowledge to fix their problems. Granted, there will be some that truely deserve a penal institution that get to avoid it but we will never see them again. I see no point in giving all of them the most severe, heinous punishment that some of them so clearly deserve when there may be some amongst them that don't deserve it. Perhaps someday we will be able to read minds and sort them out. Then we can brand the evil among them as toys and give them to the death row population to play with as they please and to discard when they're done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrishEyes Posted August 29, 2005 Report Share Posted August 29, 2005 Then we can brand the evil among them as toys and give them to the death row population to play with as they please and to discard when they're done.Man, and I thought *I* was twisted. This is a GREAT idea!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Mind Posted August 30, 2005 Report Share Posted August 30, 2005 The lines are getting foggy for me... Are we talking legal pedophilia (Someone under 18... Me :)) Or "Not yet at puberty" pedophiliacs (i.e. an eleven year old girl). Or is this becoming a mixture of both, and best judgment is used to decide who's talking about what :hihi:? I'm with UncleAl... Puberty=Open game (If consenting!) Not puberty= Life sentence in an area totally deprived non-pubescent children. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemo Posted August 31, 2005 Report Share Posted August 31, 2005 My reasoning is that for someone between the ages of puberty and legal adulthood, that person should be *legally* able to interact with someone of approximately their own age without serious legal consequences. DM - I can understand how someone in your position would have trouble with foggy lines though - defining what person may or may not be capable of consenting (and whether they will tell their father they were consenting when caught) is not a situation I would want to be in. Solid advice: avoid the problem completely - go for older women. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrishEyes Posted August 31, 2005 Report Share Posted August 31, 2005 Solid advice: avoid the problem completely - go for older women.Spoken like a man whose wife is just a few years older... :hihi:Very smart advice for guys. But even better advice for women. Get 'em young and train 'em right. :evil: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Mind Posted August 31, 2005 Report Share Posted August 31, 2005 Works out for both sexes then :hihi:. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panjandrum Posted March 18, 2006 Report Share Posted March 18, 2006 You say paedophilia is learnt, not innate? Does this mean it might be a Personality Disorder? Incidentally, I dont get why you are all so violently minded towards paedophiles. So they get off on kiddies, big deal? Actual child molesters I can see an argument for castration, by just desiring children is no problem, surely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panjandrum Posted March 18, 2006 Report Share Posted March 18, 2006 Maybe someone could make a blow-up kiddie, so paedophiles can indulge thier fanatsies without hurting anyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queso Posted March 18, 2006 Report Share Posted March 18, 2006 THAT IS SO WRONG!!!!and disgusting!and it made me chuckle :evil: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infamous Posted March 18, 2006 Report Share Posted March 18, 2006 Maybe someone could make a blow-up kiddie, so paedophiles can indulge thier fanatsies without hurting anyone.Nourish poor behavior and it will only grow in strength.................Infy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panjandrum Posted March 18, 2006 Report Share Posted March 18, 2006 Surely if they have to keep a lid on thier perversion it will merely fester until they are driven to child rape? I think it must be better to give them an outlet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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