Pyrotex Posted February 25, 2007 Report Share Posted February 25, 2007 I like the term "Bright"...I really liked the term, too. I had hoped it would catch on. I'm disappointed it did not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancaster Posted February 26, 2007 Report Share Posted February 26, 2007 I was raised Catholic and went to Catholic school for 5 years. When I started High school, I began a period of dramatic revaluation of my life. I figured out what I did and did not agree with, and my mind opened a little. It didn't occur to me at first to apply rational thought to my religion. I had been apathetic about the whole thing my entire life, though. I hated going to church and whenever my parents would say, "don't forget to say your prayers!" every night I would say "ok!" and then go right to sleep. When I began going to public high school I was exposed to the fundamentalist community of Central Florida. I looked at their beliefs and was shocked (see Evolution vs. Creationism thread for a story). I observed that they had the ability to deny scientific fact (Science was and is a topic which I am very interested in, especially because of the gifted programs I had graduated from during my public elementary school days in Northern Virginia, which gave me my desire to learn). What scared me even more was that they could completely block anything contradicting their faith and push it from their minds. I began to challenge them to defend their beliefs, and found that I had a gift for arguing. And then I began to think, am I like them? Eventually I realized that I was an Atheist, and had been my entire life, although I would go through the absurd rituals and behave like a good Catholic. I began to openly declare my Atheism and started to challenge theists. The little road I went down in my life made me much more interested in places like Hypography, and has made me a much more complete person. Everyone's an agnostic, whether they'd like to admit it or not. What? Defining yourself as Atheistic or Theistic (the only two real options, in my opinion) is completely about your own belief. If you are to define yourself as an Agnostic that is also your own personal choice. If you mean that it is impossible to know the answer to the God question, therefore everyone is an Agnostic, then you are incorrect. Many Christians know that there is a God. They step right past the "there's no evidence" issue and believe so firmly that it is no longer a matter of belief involved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IMAMONKEY! Posted February 27, 2007 Report Share Posted February 27, 2007 This is a very interesting article I found on Humanism which seems to me to be a form of rational thought that people accept as their "Religion" It makes A LOT of sense to me and i would go so far as to say I accept it as my own. What is Humanism? "Even among humanists who do believe in some sort of an afterlife, the focus is on doing good and living well in the here and now, and leaving the world better for those who come after, not on suffering through life to be rewarded afterward." That makes more sense to me than anything else I've heard in my life. :) Pyrotex 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyrotex Posted February 27, 2007 Report Share Posted February 27, 2007 My background is similar to yours, Lancaster. I was born into the Church of Christ (or is that, Chruch?), the southern, congregational, flamingly fundemental version, not to be confused with the relatively liberal United Church of Christ. I heard sermons from the pulpit condemning Southern Baptists as "liberal heathen" because they allowed their church buildings to be used for purposes other than worship. Horrors! :phones: I found it difficult to believe in much in the Bible, but even more difficult to oppose my parents or to do anything that would earn me their disapproval. So, I made myself believe, an exercise in sheer will power. The one thing I could not do, however, was pray. It made me feel silly talking to an invisible entity who gave no answers. So, I hung in there. I went to college and majored in Physics. Time and again I found myself studying things deemed "heresy" by my hometown preachers. My mind took on a fragile, bicameral structure. Late in college, the mental discord got so great that I felt it was make or break time. To please my parents (and continue the funding of my college degree) I chose to start practicing to become a preacher. Surely, that would secure my faith once and for all. In graduate school, my efforts were losing ground. There was just one thing for it--I would read the entire Bible straight through. I had several weeks off between semesters. I stayed at my apartment in school and tackled King James. I managed to read the Bible twice--thoroughly--in about two weeks. I was in shock. The Bible was nothing like I had been told it was. I had a good long cry, and put the Bible back on my bookshelf. I never took it down again. Haven't to this day. Decades later, I began researching the origin of the Bible, and of modern Christianity, and I have never regretted that decision in grad school. The Bible is, in my opinion, a cruel malicious hoax. And those who beat their children over the heads with it, are guilty of mental and spiritual abuse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IMAMONKEY! Posted February 27, 2007 Report Share Posted February 27, 2007 My background is similar to yours, Lancaster. I was born into the Church of Christ (or is that, Chruch?), the southern, congregational, flamingly fundemental version, not to be confused with the relatively liberal United Church of Christ. I heard sermons from the pulpit condemning Southern Baptists as "liberal heathen" because they allowed their church buildings to be used for purposes other than worship. Horrors! :phones: I found it difficult to believe in much in the Bible, but even more difficult to oppose my parents or to do anything that would earn me their disapproval. So, I made myself believe, an exercise in sheer will power. The one thing I could not do, however, was pray. It made me feel silly talking to an invisible entity who gave no answers. So, I hung in there. I went to college and majored in Physics. Time and again I found myself studying things deemed "heresy" by my hometown preachers. My mind took on a fragile, bicameral structure. Late in college, the mental discord got so great that I felt it was make or break time. To please my parents (and continue the funding of my college degree) I chose to start practicing to become a preacher. Surely, that would secure my faith once and for all. In graduate school, my efforts were losing ground. There was just one thing for it--I would read the entire Bible straight through. I had several weeks off between semesters. I stayed at my apartment in school and tackled King James. I managed to read the Bible twice--thoroughly--in about two weeks. I was in shock. The Bible was nothing like I had been told it was. I had a good long cry, and put the Bible back on my bookshelf. I never took it down again. Haven't to this day. Decades later, I began researching the origin of the Bible, and of modern Christianity, and I have never regretted that decision in grad school. The Bible is, in my opinion, a cruel malicious hoax. And those who beat their children over the heads with it, are guilty of mental and spiritual abuse. Beautiful Story.. My gosh that makes me wanna cry. I agree with you whole-heartedly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larv Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Defining yourself as Atheistic or Theistic (the only two real options, in my opinion) is completely about your own belief. If you are to define yourself as an Agnostic that is also your own personal choice.I define myself as an untheist: I believe it doesn't matter if there is or isn't a god. —Larv Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancaster Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 I define myself as an untheist: I believe it doesn't matter if there is or isn't a god. —Larv The name for what you are is apathetic. It certainly matters because the vast majority of people in the world believe there to be a God, and often use that belief to rationalize many foolish and evil things (suicide bombings, denial of scientific fact, etc.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgrmdave Posted February 28, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 It certainly matters because the vast majority of people in the world believe there to be a God, and often use that belief to rationalize many foolish and evil things (suicide bombings, denial of scientific fact, etc.) Does the truth matter? Or only what people believe to be true... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfiniteNow Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Does the truth matter? Or only what people believe to be true... It's an interesting question, but I'm not sure we can so easily make the distinction. The sublties of perception and understanding eliminate absolute alignment on "truths." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larv Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Does the truth matter? Or only what people believe to be true...Does a scientist care about "the truth"? It's a loaded term, too easily contorted into "The Truth." I avoid it, except in common speach, such as "Is it true, Jim, that you bought a motorcycle?" —Larv Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgrmdave Posted February 28, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 My point was simply that it is perfectly valid to say that it doesn't matter whether there is or isn't a god if your only argument against it is that people who do believe act on that belief. Assuming they are not all right, some of them believe falsely. However, their actions are not affected by the truth - only by their belief. Thus making it unimportant whether or not they are right - their actions don't change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyrotex Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 ...However, their actions are not affected by the truth - only by their belief. ....Lessee... I think I had a signature around here... Hmm, maybe it's at the bottom of my posts. :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfiniteNow Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Lessee... I think I had a signature around here... Hmm, maybe it's at the bottom of my posts. What does "The map is not the territory" have to do with anything? :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IMAMONKEY! Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Does the truth matter? Or only what people believe to be true... Truth is not always universal. There is always one thing that can warp it, mask it, or define it... Perspective. :D (oh and btw if you do know what this is from don't say. Let's just let everyone think that I came up with it :hihi:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REASON Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Truth is not always universal. There is always one thing that can warp it, mask it, or define it... Perspective. :hihi: Isaac Newton offered three Laws of Motion (Newton's Three Laws of Motion). Would these not be considered "truths?" If so, how would one's perspective affect the truth of these laws? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgrmdave Posted February 28, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Please do try to stay on topic here - feel free to create another thread in philosophy though, this conversation does seem interesting! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larv Posted March 1, 2007 Report Share Posted March 1, 2007 This poll needs a fouth option—"Other" —Larv Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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