Is Science Incompatible With Religion?

[Sebastianlobo]

Science beeing a method of thought and investigation, or an enquiry based on some kind of hypothesis, how could it possibly be carried out by those who believe in the existence of an ultimate truth, usually by divine revelation?

[ughaibu]

Likes of Kepler and Newton were motivated by religion. They wanted to demonstrate the involvement of god by showing that the universe was mathematically determined.

[Sebastianlobo]

Precisely. They wanted to " read the mind of god", and so did Einstein, who devoted the last 30 years of his life to the development of the Unified Field Theory - expressing the mind of god in one equation.This takes us to several points of seminal importance, among them the compartmentalisation of Science.But, getting back to the original question, would anybody consider that, in terms of Evolution through Natural Selection and the knowledge available today from other fields of investiagtion, taking the existence of god is a sound premise? It would be throwing Relativity and Quantum Physics down into the garbage dump? And what about the workings, strategies and illusions the brain leads us into? Damasio's book, The Error of Descartes, and Richard Gregory, from the University of Nottingham, have raiseed some very tough questions on this subject.

[Zythryn]

Science and religion can happily coexist.

Now, an individuals interpretation of either can be such that it precludes the other. For example, if someone's religious standpoint requires them to take the KJB as word for word fact, and science proves that grasshoppers don't have the number of legs that the bible indicates, something has to give:)

 

So, on further inspection, I guess it depends on your personal interpretation of religion. As this is different for different people, the answer will be different depending upon who you ask.

[HydrogenBond]

Religion came before science and is still going strong. Science gradually appeared and detoured off religion. One took the high road to truth and the other the low road to truth but eventually they will both meet again.

 

For example, religion has always taught about an alternate reality or spiritual realm that is not material in nature. Science initially focused on the material nature of reality to separate out the spiritual hogwash. Now in physics, there is all types of speculation about other dimensions, parallel universes, etc. If this science really pans outs and is not just fantasy being called science, the two paths may meet there. This opens an interesting sci fi story line for a book, where science and religion have to team together to protect earth from a demon realm that is unleased on the earth by physicists tampering with other dimensions.

[CraigD]

Religion came before science and is still going strong….

I agree.

For example, religion has always taught about an alternate reality or spiritual realm that is not material in nature.

Though very widely believed, objective historical evidence indicates this to be a misconception. Early religions appear to lack the concept of “alternate realities”, placing their “place of the gods” simply somewhere remote, such as over an ocean or atop a high mountain.

 

As explorations geographic and scientific advances knowledge of the physical world, it appears that religion and myth was forced to place these territories in increasingly remote places. Sometimes, science aided religion in finding such places – in the 19th century, some unconventional yet moderately popular religions proposed that the souls of dead or yet-to-be-born humans lived on extraterrestrial planets!

 

I went into a bit more detail about this in the post ”The coevolution of relegion ideas of heaven and scientific ideas of astronomy, etc.”

This opens an interesting sci fi story line for a book, where science and religion have to team together to protect earth from a demon realm that is unleased on the earth by physicists tampering with other dimensions.

If you’ve not already, you might enjoy Philip K Dick’s “VALIS”, or Keith Laumer’s “A Plague of Demons”. Both involve a convergence of science and religion, though they come at it from very different directions.

[beccareb]

I think it really depends how strictly one views religion. It would be difficult for a Roman Catholic, who believes everything the church and the bible say word-for-word, to believe accept parts of scientific theory. Other people are much more individual with their beliefs. For example, I once had a pastor at a local church explain to me how he could believe in the Christian religion completely and still support the theory of evolution.

 

An interesting side note- A few years ago in an AP Biology class, one of the guys (raised Christian, but not really relgious) said that he believed that a complicated biology class was the best proof he'd ever seen for a god. A fair number of people agreed

[beccareb]

Another point- if you want to accept science and be religious, you can find a way to make it fit. Conversely, if you want science to disprove religion, you can find a way to "prove" to yourself that it does.

[HydrogenBond]

I going to do something fun and continue the sci- fi story. When the physicists learn to open a door to other dimensions they unknowingly open a door to a dimension that had been reserved for ancient demons. With this door open, the demons pour out and begin to flood into our dimension. Their appearance freaks out the scientists making them unable to reverse what they have done. They can barely stay intellectually afloat within the panic and fear that being created within them.

 

Where religion comes in, is that it provides a way to help the scientists calm their hearts away from their freak-out panic attacks. With their feet back in reality they begin to team together and are able to close the hole. But the damage has already been done with legions and legions of demons already all over the earth, freaking the crap out of everyone, creating world wide panic.

 

To add to the problem, the demons begin a type of metamorphesis, where they begin to organize increasing their collective strength. The scientists have been working on a weapon but a practical prototype is still years off and the demon organization is getting stronger each day, almost making the weapon obsolete before it is built.

 

This is where religion comes back in. What it does is organize the human spirit into a type of world wide prayer. The power of the collective human mind opens up another dimension allowing in some guardian angels who are ready to kick some demon butt.

 

After the butt kicking, religion and science work together to develop the new dimension opening technology with religion helping to define the types of dimensions that are safe for investigation.

[CraigD]

I going to do something fun and continue the sci- fi story. When the physicists learn to open a door to other dimensions they unknowingly open a door to a dimension that had been reserved for ancient demons.

…

Where religion comes in, is that it provides a way to help the scientists calm their hearts away from their freak-out panic attacks.

…

I’ve a suggestion.

 

Even with science and religion working in harmony, the demon onslaught seems overwhelming. Enter bureaucracy. The demons, annoyed by various administrative issues involved in the creation of hell on Earth, contract with a major human management consulting firm. Within months, the consultants have the demons so bewildered and preoccupied with covering their own asses that they become ineffectual, giving humanity the needed time to perfect their trans-dimensional opener/closers and weapons. By the end, the demons are eager to go back to from whence they came. A few of the consultants join them. ;)

[hallenrm]

I think science and religion are complementary to one another. While science addresses everything physical, religion concerns itself with spiritual matters. Both are necessary for the survival of human beings. The fruits of science and technology provide the resources for the survival, while religion provides the resources for human beings to find a meaning for life after survival appears to be assured by the application of the knowledge of science and technology.

 

In another thread, Perils of prosperity, the Maslows theory of human conduct came into focus, and there I have contended that while science and technology take care of the lower two levels, for the human needs of level three, four and fifth the science is not really sufficient.:hihi:

[Sebastianlobo]

The word religion has its roots in the Latin religare which means to tie back, to reconnect, the assumption being that man was once connected to god(s), severed the connection and then re – established it.

 

Considering that you can only tie back what was once tied, the question is whether this hypothesis, at the most, is scientifically reasonable.

 

Of course one could argue that quite a few scientific discoveries were a consequence of mere chance or a “ what if” attitude, the thought experiment put forward by, among other, Richard Dawkins in The Extended Phenotype. But this objection does not really apply to my argument, at least it does not seem to.

 

That we all have beliefs is a fact, the point is what the reasons are that lead us to any particular belief. In almost all religions these reasons are dogmas ( I am excluding, at the moment, Hinduism, Budhism and similar concepts). In fact, many people are dogmatic on various topics, thus exposing their religious attitude.

 

Now, in terms of attitude I cannot overemphasize that it is precisely what atheism: it is not a belief or creed and requires an independence of mind which, in my view, is essential to the scientific method.

 

As for Newton and Kepler – and their followers – not only do we not really know what and how they felt about God , but they might have hidden their true views behind their writings, particularly due to Christian pressures on thoughts and ideas. They might very well have had to negotiate the intolerance then prevailing.

 

Freud had the same problem. The first translation of his works into English, by Lytton Strachey, had to give to his views a “ scientific” twist due to the morality of the time. The result being that he has been misquoted and misunderstood since then.

 

Finally, the idea of a god, without which religion would not exist, implies that there is a purpose to all things. It happens that, the knowledge we have at the moment, stemming from Evolutionary Biology and Cosmology, seem to suggest that there is no purpose in life, the universe or even the multiverses.

 

Speculative thinking, one might say! Undoubtedly.

 

The jury is still out on these matters and nobody really knows if it will get back into the courtroom within our lifespan.

[Freddy]

Science is knowledge, religion is nonsense.

[Mercedes Benzene]

Hasn't this topic been covered in like 5 different threads within the last month??

 

Anyway. I do not believe that science in incompatible with religion.

Science is fact.

Religion is totally based on faith. They are two different things.

 

People believe in many theories related to science that cannot be proven.

Why can't they also believe in a god or God?

It's completely opinion, and what the individual WANTS to believe.

 

:confused:

[Rincewind]

They're only incompatible if you try understanding science from a religious viewpoint or religion from a scientific one. Otherwise, they are two sides of the very complex coin that we know as existence.

[Qfwfq]

It would be difficult for a Roman Catholic, who believes everything the church and the bible say word-for-word, to believe accept parts of scientific theory.

Why? :)

 

Firstly, the Catholic church has a tradition of reading the scriptures hermeneutically. Second, there are countless Catholic scientists, and Galileo was one of them. In particular, ask a Jesuit priest whether he believes in Creationism or Darwin.

[Sebastianlobo]

Dear Freddy,

 

You would have to back up your claim with an argument.If you do not, you are as credulous as any religious person is. Anyway, I think Wilde is worthwhile quoting : " Science without Religion is lame.Religion without Science is blind."

SL