Is there a finite number of different images we can possibly see?

[Evolute]

13 minutes ago, exchemist said:

This person is mentally ill

Actually, that was my initial suspicion but I didn't think I would be allowed to express that conclusion but I suspected as much. Time to walk away then. Thank you.

1 minute ago, Omnifarious said:

I'll have you know your post came in while I was talking to my therapist about this very issue

I see.

2 minutes ago, Omnifarious said:

She said I was not mentally ill and that you a rude and abusive bully

And you agree? Or not.

[write4u]

On 2/20/2021 at 8:36 AM, Omnifarious said:

I have considered before what you've said about eye movement. But it occurred to me that if muscles move when stimulated by electric signals, is there a minimum amount a muscle can move? Thus still making our perception finite?

Your muscles can only move a finite amount  because the contraction is due to microtubules sliding over each other and even as many microtubules are involved their size and range of movement is limited.

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Unlike plants (and plant cells), animals (and often individual animal cells) are capable of movement. This process requires both a firm structure to provide leverage as well as a mechanism for moving that structure. In multicellular animals, these components are the skeleton and muscles. In single-celled animals and individual cells, these components are often flagella and/or cilia. All of these structures rely on both motor proteins and components of the cytoskeleton.

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The cytoskeleton (literally, “cell skeleton”) is a network of filaments that supports the plasma membrane, gives the cell an overall shape, aids in the correct positioning of organelles, provides tracks for the transport of vesicles, and (in many cell types) allows the cell to move. In eukaryotes, there are three types of protein fibers in the cytoskeleton: microfilaments, intermediate filaments, and microtubules. Mirofilaments and microtubles serve as tracks for movement of motor proteins, which use energy in the form of ATP to “walk along” these cytoskeletal filaments. (Intermediate filaments are not associated with motor proteins.) For the purposes of this course, we’ll discuss microfilaments, microtubules, and their associated motor proteins to describe their roles in cilia, flagella, and muscle: ......more

 

https://organismalbio.biosci.gatech.edu/chemical-and-electrical-signals/effectors-and-movement/

Edited February 23, 2021 by write4u

[write4u]

Muscle Contraction and Locomotion

The information below was adapted from OpenStax Biology 38.4

 

Quote

 

ATP, motor motor proteins, and actin microfiliament tracks are essential for contraction of eukaryotic muscle. Muscles allow for motions such as walking, and they also facilitate bodily processes such as respiration and digestion. The vertebrate body contains three types of muscle tissue: skeletal muscle, cardiac muscle, and smooth muscle:

 

• Quote

  Skeletal muscle tissue forms skeletal muscles, which attach to bones or skin and control locomotion and any movement that can be consciously controlled. Because it can be controlled by thought, skeletal muscle is also called voluntary muscle. Skeletal muscles are long and cylindrical in appearance; when viewed under a microscope, skeletal muscle tissue has a striped or striated appearance. The striations are caused by the regular arrangement of contractile proteins (actin and myosin). Actin is a globular contractile protein that interacts with myosin for muscle contraction. Skeletal muscle also has multiple nuclei present in a single cell.

  Quote

  Smooth muscle tissue occurs in the walls of hollow organs such as the intestines, stomach, and urinary bladder, and around passages such as the respiratory tract and blood vessels. Smooth muscle has no striations, is not under voluntary control, has only one nucleus per cell, is tapered at both ends, and is called involuntary muscle.

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  Cardiac muscle tissue is only found in the heart, and cardiac contractions pump blood throughout the body and maintain blood pressure. Like skeletal muscle, cardiac muscle is striated, but unlike skeletal muscle, cardiac muscle cannot be consciously controlled and is called involuntary muscle. The nervous system can speed up or slow down the heart rate, but the heart can also beat without nervous system input due to a set of cells called pacemaker cells that spontaneously initiate cardiac muscle contraction. It has one nucleus per cell, is branched, and is distinguished by the presence of intercalated disks, which enable rapid passage of action potentials from one cardiac muscle cell to the next.

https://organismalbio.biosci.gatech.edu/chemical-and-electrical-signals/effectors-and-movement/

and for further reading;

https://skeletalmusclejournal.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13395-018-0176-8#

and for pacemaker cells ;

https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/1535370219868960 

Edited February 23, 2021 by write4u

[OceanBreeze]

1 hour ago, exchemist said:

This person is mentally ill, having posted exactly the same stuff elsewhere 18 months ago, under the name Tailspin:

http://www.thescienceforum.com/biology/49276-what-mechanics-perception-does-limit-our-perception.html

Hello Exchemist. Normally I would be very pleased to see you posting again on this forum. But in this case, I have to say that dropping in just to post something negative about another member is bad form. What drives you to do that when I know you are capable of so much better?

[Evolute]

It's difficult to reason with a fearful person, write4u. Especially one who's mind appears to be pretty much made up?

Edited February 23, 2021 by Evolute

[write4u]

7 hours ago, Evolute said:

It's difficult to reason with a fearful person, write4u. Especially one who's mind appears to be pretty much made up?

I have confidence that the human mind is able to change the fight or flight instinct into awe and wonder of the majesty that reveals itself every day. 

It may just be a matter of overcoming resistance of feeling removed from the grandeur to feeling connected and playing a small part in this extraordinary adventure we call life.

Today we are able to visually travel into space and explore the "infinite" variety of wonders that just a simple mathematical fractal algorithm can create for our study and enjoyment.

What are Fractals?

http://fractalfoundation.wolfesongs.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/sierpinski-zoom41.gif

Quote

A fractal is a never-ending pattern. Fractals are infinitely complex patterns that are self-similar across different scales. They are created by repeating a simple process over and over in an ongoing feedback loop. Driven by recursion, fractals are images of dynamic systems – the pictures of Chaos. Geometrically, they exist in between our familiar dimensions. Fractal patterns are extremely familiar, since nature is full of fractals. For instance: trees, rivers, coastlines, mountains, clouds, seashells, hurricanes, etc. Abstract fractals – such as the Mandelbrot Set – can be generated by a computer calculating a simple equation over and over.

Watch the zoom of the Mandelbrot fractal and marvel at the infinite variety contained in the simple triangulation of patterns. The beauty lies in the fact that the fundamental mathematical function is simple but is able to create infinitely complex patterns.

https://fractalfoundation.org/resources/what-are-fractals/

Edited February 24, 2021 by write4u

[Omnifarious]

On 2/23/2021 at 6:24 PM, Evolute said:

It's difficult to reason with a fearful person, write4u. Especially one who's mind appears to be pretty much made up?

I haven't actually seen write4u's latest post because I blocked him/her. Not for upsetting me but for being so unscientific.

But my mind is not made up, I am not determined to believe it. If anything I want to dis-believe it. Actually believe is not the right word, I want to know if it's true or not. I wondered if photoreceptors work like pixels and I found someone, the creator of that image, who said yes. I just want to know if that person is speaking scientific truth or personal opinion.

And I strongly resent Evolute's claim that I am mentally ill. I admit I can be obsessional and struggle with depression. But that doesn't mean I should not be engaged with or my words ignored as the meaningless rantings of a lunatic. I'm having a discussion on a forum, not telling people on the street about how my tinfoil hat keeps the Illuminati from reading my mind. There is a difference between talking to a therapist for an hour a week and being consigned to a padded room in a straitjacket.

And exactly what qualifies Evolute to diagnose anyone as mentally ill anyway? Even my therapist said she wasn't qualified to do that.

Furthermore, so what if I've asked this before? What harm is it doing? Any why come here and tell everyone about it and that I'm mad? Who are you, the Forum Police? Why are question forums so strict, are web pages rationed?

[Omnifarious]

On 2/20/2021 at 7:00 PM, sluggo said:

Omni;

Science is still discovering new things in all fields. That is enough to conclude science doesn't have complete knowledge of everything.

.

Ok but how complete is our knowledge of photoreceptors?

[Evolute]

1 hour ago, Omnifarious said:

or my words ignored as the meaningless rantings of a lunatic.

I have not ignored you/ Lunatic? No. Fearful? Seems like it if your first post were your true feelings. And I never claimed you were mentally ill, only that I suspected the possibility based on your apparent deep fear of this pixelation for how the Human eye picks up things. I still think it's an unfortunate viewpoint for real world visual experiences. Maybe you'll get passed it some day. I would hope that you do.

1 hour ago, Omnifarious said:

Furthermore, so what if I've asked this before? What harm is it doing? Any why come here and tell everyone about it and that I'm mad? Who are you, the Forum Police? Why are question forums so strict, are web pages rationed?

Calm down, no one is attacking you. Check the responses that have scientific references. Why do you not think people are trying to assist you in your quest for answers?

1 hour ago, Omnifarious said:

Ok but how complete is our knowledge of photoreceptors?

I'll take that question if I may. How could anyone possibly know that? I would suggest that instead of this Forum maybe you should try to go direct to a scientific institution that actually studies what you are asking about? If you're not satisfied with what you're getting here, do what I do. Email the experts and scientists in the particular field that I'm interested in. I've been doing that to gain more knowledge regarding DNA. You'd be surprised how open scientists are to outside questions like yours 🙂 ....and mine.

[write4u]

On 2/26/2021 at 6:38 PM, Omnifarious said:

I haven't actually seen write4u's latest post because I blocked him/her. Not for upsetting me but for being so unscientific.

It appears that Omnifarious is actively resisting researching any information. If he had looked up the definition of a "pixel" and then compared it to the three color sensitive cones in the eyes, he could have easily come to the conclusion that the eye acts as a pixilator, i.e. mixing of three primary colors to generate a pixilated color.

But if he is not interested in my "unscientific" approach, then this will be my last response to any of his  unscientific infantile requests, including the foot stomping when his desires aren't immediately satisfied.

I won't waste any more of my time on this specimen......

 

 

Edited February 28, 2021 by write4u

[Evolute]

I would have to concur, write4u.

[Omnifarious]

On 2/27/2021 at 4:42 AM, Evolute said:

I'll take that question if I may. How could anyone possibly know that? I would suggest that instead of this Forum maybe you should try to go direct to a scientific institution that actually studies what you are asking about? If you're not satisfied with what you're getting here, do what I do. Email the experts and scientists in the particular field that I'm interested in. I've been doing that to gain more knowledge regarding DNA. You'd be surprised how open scientists are to outside questions like yours 🙂 ....and mine.

I assumed the people here are experts. Or at least far more knowledgeable about scientific matters then me.

In my experience you can't just find a scientist. You can't find them in the yellow pages. And you can't google "Scientists in my area." I know because I just tried it.

And you can't just call them up to ask them something out of the blue. I know because I did that too. I found a professor of quantum mechanics teaching at a university. I left a message for her and to my surprise she called back. But it was still really awkward and she hadn't even heard of the thing I was asking about.

[Evolute]

I somehow don't think science Forums are made up of panels of PhD's of various disciplines. I belong to several Forums outside this one. Not all are scientific, but I've yet to run across very many at all that I would consider having experts on board. Most are discussion type Forums that discuss subjects more than solve them. And I've been hit or miss with academia myself even when it came to a Harvard geophysics professor addressing my climate change questions regarding Milankovitch Cycles. So you're not alone.

Edited March 4, 2021 by Evolute

[Omnifarious]

On 3/4/2021 at 10:13 PM, Evolute said:

I somehow don't think science Forums are made up of panels of PhD's of various disciplines. I belong to several Forums outside this one. Not all are scientific, but I've yet to run across very many at all that I would consider having experts on board. Most are discussion type Forums that discuss subjects more than solve them. And I've been hit or miss with academia myself even when it came to a Harvard geophysics professor addressing my climate change questions regarding Milankovitch Cycles. So you're not alone.

So all the people that I've been talking to here are just armatures, enthusiasts and hobbyists? 

I wanted to know if thing things I'm worried about are true. I assume that science already has the answers and the people here have access to that information. That all the stuff I've asked about is a matter of public record. Is that not the case?

[Evolute]

You've been giving scientific data. Either you accept it or you don't. ALL of it is a matter of public record. If some here can find and post the data then you can also.

[Omnifarious]

On 3/13/2021 at 5:28 AM, Evolute said:

You've been giving scientific data.

I think you mean given.

On 3/13/2021 at 5:28 AM, Evolute said:

ALL of it is a matter of public record. If some here can find and post the data then you can also.

Are you saying the info given to me here is true?

On 3/13/2021 at 5:28 AM, Evolute said:

You've been giving scientific data. Either you accept it or you don't.

I was just talking to my therapist about this earlier. When I receive data I don't decide weather to accept it or not. I accept all of it. I am aware that there are things that scientists disagree on and things they all agree on. But I can't tell which category things like the ones I've been talking about fall into. I always assume it's the latter. Not that I'm gullible but when scientific information is given to me in any media, I can't help but assume it's already been proven beyond all doubt. Especially because I assume the people who do it are far more qualified then me.

And it's not just science, I have difficulty arguing with most people. When they say this is the way thing are, I assume they know more then me. When my opinion clashes with theirs's, I think there might be something wrong with mine.

I have very black and white thinking, I don't think my brain can process the idea of a partial truth, something being between true and false.

[write4u]

It's a "given"......... 😊