The 2012 Prophecies

[modest]

There actually is no 2012 "prophecy" made by the Mayans. It never existed.

I could compile an impressive list of Mayan historical documents and half a dozen codexes (or codeces if you prefer) which put the lie to your above ridiculous statement.

 

Please do.

 

Michael,

I do not believe you. Go ahead and prove me wrong.

 

Michael, Please quote any example of a 2012 prophecy out of any Mayan codex.

 

;) Backing up claims is a site rule

 

~modest

[Michael Mooney]

Modest:

Michael, Please quote any example of a 2012 prophecy out of any Mayan codex.

 

Backing up claims is a site rule

I will have to either get my copy of Shearer's book, Lord of the Dawn... back from a friend who moved away... or buy a new one...to comply, because it was his reading of Mayan codex from which I and Barns & Nobles quoted re the "Blossoming of the Tree of Life..." in 2012.

I cited his book in my first post here as my primary source for the prophecy, along with the "claim" that he based it on translation/interpretation of Mayan codex, which he did.

You are on a witch hunt here, looking for a reason to burn me.

 

As I have already said...

To Moontanman:

If you have any interest in the 2012 prophecy and "Q" as the Mayan Avatar, (other than peanut gallery ridicule from ignorance, as above) check out the book. It is excellent... the basis of a whole chapter** in one of my books on prophecy, The Crystal Capstone...

And...

 

To Freeztar:

He (Quetzalcoatl) said, "The Tree of Life shall blossom with a fruit never known before."

This was a direct translation by Tony Shearer of one of the ancient Mayan Codexes. I spent many hours in a library (before computers in my life) studying Mayan codexes but don't remember which one contains the quote.*

 

Seems you didn't even read any of the above.

 

This will either take awhile or you can look it up in quoted book (interpreting codex) yourself... or take this opportunity to ban me for non-compliance.

(My research of Mayan codices was to verify Shearer's source and how reasonable his interpretation of the codex seemed to me. It "passed with flying colors."

 

Are you going to set a time limit on my fulfillment of this assignment before you flunk me, teacher?

Do you get off on your power as an enforcer here, or is that too personal and off topic?

Michael

[modest]

The only inscription in all of the Mayan corpus mentioning the end of the 13th b'ahktun is given in post #76. I quote wikipedia:

Monument 6 from Tortuguero is currently generating discussion as it includes the only known inscription depicting the end of the current 13-baktun era in 2012.

Tortuguero (Maya site) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

There are, therefore, no such inscriptions in the codices.

 

~modest

[RCP/CRT/RRT]

Modest:

You are on a witch hunt here, looking for a reason to burn me.

Oh no, no, If there were a witch hunt, you would've been burned a long time ago!

:P:thumbs_up:thumbs_do

 

Thanks for that though... Laughter is so good! :)

 

Seriously though, seems there has been quite a bit of tolerance afforded you here, considering this is primarily a science forum....

[Pyrotex]

Amen.

[Michael Mooney]

Oh no, no, If there were a witch hunt, you would've been burned a long time ago!

:P:thumbs_up:thumbs_do

 

Thanks for that though... Laughter is so good! :)

 

Seriously though, seems there has been quite a bit of tolerance afforded you here, considering this is primarily a science forum....

 

The joy of sadistically torturing those who disagree with you is quite disturbing here. You could use some therapy. I am quite expensive as a therapist but I will give an absolutely free reply here to hopefully embarrass you into a mode which contemplates the "hope" embodied in the prophecy.

 

RCP:

"Oh no, no, If there were a witch hunt, you would've been burned a long time ago!"

 

WOW! In your opinion I am so bad that I deserved a very painful death "a long time ago."

 

You can go directly to the head of the line of people who thrive on hate and wish others pain and death... i.e., those who are "part of the problem" as I said

(vis-a-vis the "thirteen 'heavens' of decreasing choice and nine hells of increasing doom"...in the *full context* of all glyphs, codices, and prophetic interpretations... from all periods of investigation.)

"Seriously though, seems there has been quite a bit of tolerance afforded you here, considering this is primarily a science forum...."

 

Seriously though, considering that this the "Strange Claims" section of the "Alternative theories" forum, a discussion of the Mayan prophecy for 2012 could proceed in a more respectful manner than your extreme hostility and wish for a tortured death for all who disagree with the established doctrine of scientific materialism which rules, persecutes, and condemns dissent here.

Michael

[Michael Mooney]

Amen.

The head of the Inquisition has given his blessing upon the burning of the accused witch!

Who will light the fire?

M

[freeztar]

Michael, I look forward to when you get back on track and address Modest's last reply to this thread. He claims there is no mention of the thirteenth baktun in the codices and he provided a source. If you disagree, please provide a source and show us where this information is located. Asking all of us to read an entire book to support your claim is absurd. You do the research and get back to us when you have it.

[RCP/CRT/RRT]

The joy of sadistically torturing those who disagree with you is quite disturbing here. You could use some therapy. I am quite expensive as a therapist but I will give an absolutely free reply here to hopefully embarrass you into a mode which contemplates the "hope" embodied in the prophecy.

 

RCP:

 

 

WOW! In your opinion I am so bad that I deserved a very painful death "a long time ago."

 

You can go directly to the head of the line of people who thrive on hate and wish others pain and death... i.e., those who are "part of the problem" as I said

(vis-a-vis the "thirteen 'heavens' of decreasing choice and nine hells of increasing doom"...in the *full context* of all glyphs, codices, and prophetic interpretations... from all periods of investigation.)

 

 

Seriously though, considering that this the "Strange Claims" section of the "Alternative theories" forum, a discussion of the Mayan prophecy for 2012 could proceed in a more respectful manner than your extreme hostility and wish for a tortured death for all who disagree with the established doctrine of scientific materialism which rules, persecutes, and condemns dissent here.

Michael

 

Oh my, my wife, nor even my neighbors wife, has not the flare for dramatics and petty manipulation you are graced with.:thumbs_up

 

I found myself laughing out loud, thank you, at the irony & melodrama of your statement, no denying it. Had anyone been out to "burn" you as you dramatically put it. It needn't be dependent on your ability to produce a codex.

By the way, I would come up with these codices you promised... They seem pretty serious.

 

Had I believed we actually burned witches here, I would have joined a long time ago! (That is a joke Michael, or is it??? Hmmm.... Better keep the matches put away just to be safe)

[CraigD]

This entire Mayan 2012 scare is based on ONE fact: the biggest and most complete Mayan "wheel" calendar that we have found only goes as far as 2012 CE.

It isn’t accurate to say that the Mesoamerican Long Count Calendar runs out of dates on 21 Dec 2012. According to the most accepted interpretation (the most accepted GMT correlation), 20 Dec 2012 is LC 12.19.19.17.19, 21 Dec is LC 13.0.0.0.0, 22 Dec is LC 13.0.0.0.1, and so on.

 

It will run out of digits, like our Gregorian calendar did on Jan 1 1000, on 11 July 4378, and even then, there’s no reason it couldn’t just gain another digit, as our Gregorian calendar did, to advance from 19.19.19.17.19 to 1.0.0.0.0.0.

 

The Long Count also isn’t the Mayan wheel calendar. The Wheel calendar is 18980 days (260 x 365 / GCF(260,365) = 260 x 365 / 5), about 14 days less than 52 years, long (and thus not much good for describing event more than 52 years in the future of past). The Long Count is just a base 20 number, except for the second least significant digit, which is base 18. The two don’t sync up very well, with the LC rolling over two least significant digits on a Wheel rollover about every 935.4 years, three digits about every 18707.2.

But gee, don't nearly ALL calendars, from whoever, extend only just so far?

The calendar on my wall (showing Hubble photographs) extends only as far as December 31, 2009.

Neither the Long Count nor the Wheel is a calendar in the sense that modern wall calendars are – they’re not planners, but more like the digital date displays on a watch, computer, or cellphone display, marking a specific day (though in the case of the Wheel, not uniquely).

The long count ends on Dec. 21, 2012? That's a solstice. That seems incredibly odd to me.

This is odd to me, too.

 

Some history of the anthropological problem of translating Long Count to Gregorian dates – the correlation problem – is useful. This webpage seems to me to present a good brief history. In short, however, the best anthropologists’ guesses as to what Gregorian calendar date LC 13.0.0.0.0 falls actually are actually 19, 20, 21 (the 3 possible Goodman, Martinez, Thompson dates) or 23 Dec 2012 (Lounsbury’s date).

 

The reason for this uncertainty is that the Long Count fell into disuse before documented European contact with the Mayan’s, so none of the Mayan’s with whom European could compare dates knew what the LC date was, only the wheel date. As explained at the preceeding linked-to page, this required much research and guessing to work around.

How could the Mayans create a calender more than 1,000 years ago knowing it would end on a solstice in our time?

As I noted above, the LC doesn’t end on 13.0.0.0.0, but even just a four-digit rollover falling on an astronomically important date is remarkable.

 

I’ve not been able to find any documentation supporting this idea, but when GMT and Lounsbury worked on their calculations from about 1890 to 1940, it’s possible one of the proposed correlation factor was chosen in part to have 13.0.0.0.0 fall exactly on the solstice.

 

The last time the LC rolled over 4 digits, 12.0.0.0.0, was according to the most popular GMT date 18 Sep 1618, a date AFAIK astronomically unremarkable.

 

We discussed this about a year ago, around post #24 of the strange claims thread 16290.

[RCP/CRT/RRT]

MM, You do understand (??) that no one is actually going to burn on a stake regardless of your position here? Worst case scenario is you get banned without having a final say...

 

Just clarifying in case you live in fear, as your mentality implies, your "virtual" world intersects reality...

 

BTW, your expensive therapy treatment seems rather ineffective on the coherent...

[freeztar]

Play the ball not the person. Let's stay on track.

[paigetheoracle]

I personally believe the world will end with a wimper and not a bang. This is because I think all noise, all violent events like war etc. are aimed at getting our attention as with people banging on drums to get others to notice their new circus in town. It is when boredom sets in (as now) that the audience disperses and the world goes back to sleep i.e. civilizations end.

[BrianG]

Millions of people will die in 2012.

 

But, millions die every year.

[Jet2]

Anything could happen, but no one can predict any natural disaster yet.

Unless it's an UN-NATURAL one.

[paigetheoracle]

Millions of people will die in 2012.

 

But, millions die every year.

 

This reply should be in the Quality Jokes thread of the Water cooler section!:)

[paigetheoracle]

Anything could happen, but no one can predict any natural disaster yet.

Unless it's an UN-NATURAL one.

 

It's easy to predict what you can create as an effect, unless you let others know what you're going to do because then it becomes known and can be countered as any terrorist will tell you.