Perception of time

[rileyj]

do flys perceive time different from humans? how come when the flight or fight respones kicks in time seems to move a bit slower? when i was in a car accident it seemed that way, both times is it caused by chemical or electrical means in our body

[Noah]

From my (vague) understanding of it, it is caused by the adrenaline in your body, which helps to speed you up. Also you brain shifts all its attention to the situation at hand, allowing you to make split-second decisions. So I would say it's a mixture of chemicals being released, and your mind working to send the electrical signals out at top speed to control your body as needed.

 

It is a very odd feeling, definitely. I was in a pretty bad motorcycle accident last fall (I walked away, messed up my tailbone and possibly caused some slight nerve damage in my back, but the motorcycles trashed), and I remember very vividly during one of the flips (it was going end over end), I was looking straight up at one of the prettiest blues skies I have ever seen, and out the sides of my eyes I could see the green trees rising up from around the trail, but the peacefulness was broke by seeing the bike upside down over me. Scarey, but it's cool how your mind can capture so much detail about a fraction of a second like that.

[Tormod]

I distinctly remember one incident where I had left a kettle of water on the stove and sat in front of my computer when I suddenly sensed smoke. I suddenly realized what was going on and I remember running in slow motion through my (smoke filled) apartment towards the stove, seeing the emtpy kettle and feeling the intense heat from the stove. It all went well (luckily) but man I was really, really afraid for a while. I still see the entire event in my mind and it is almost like a movie.

 

I wonder if it was perhaps a sense of fear and urgency which caused my brain to react in this way.

 

Tormod

[Freethinker]

Your situation forced more of your brain to focus on that specific issue. Thus it was not so much a change in time perception, as it is focused attention on an individual event.

 

Compare it to viewing a scene from two different camers. One wide angle, one narrow angle. Take an event that has something move across a limited viewing angle across the screen. The wide angle shot will provide less detail for the same movement than the narrow angle. In one the, say 2 degrees of arc of, movement represents 10% of the view. While the other, the same 2 degrees is 50% of the view. Both capture the same event in the same time frame. One just will provide greater detail and review of it will show much greater detail.

[Tormod]

Originally posted by: Freethinker

Your situation forced more of your brain to focus on that specific issue. Thus it was not so much a change in time perception, as it is focused attention on an individual event.

 

Well, that is kind of obvious.

 

But it does not explain why it was experienced in slow motion, which I find very interesting. I still sense fear when I think of the event.

 

But psychologists also need to make a living.

 

Tormod

[Freethinker]

Originally posted by: Tormod

But it does not explain why it was experienced in slow motion, which I find very interesting. I still sense fear when I think of the event.

 

"experienced in slow motion" is relative. There is nothing about time that allows one individual control over it's passing. Thus you could not have "experienced in slow motion", you could only PERCIEVE it in a different reference frame. The same could be said for sleeping. One could say that while asleep they "experienced in fast motion", in that a large period of time passes with very little attention to the details.

 

It would be more accurate to say that the frame of reference changed, and that it was PECEPTION, not TIME that changed.

[Tormod]

I never claimed that time changed, only my experience of it. In fact I never even mentioned the word "time", just "slow motion". Of course the perception of time is relative (ask any 5-year old on Christmas eve).

 

I disagree with the separation of experience and perception in this case. They are one and the same to me. I guess I could be more precise by saying my *experience* was that I *perceived* events in slow motion - but that is really nitpicking.

 

As far as I can understand rileyj's original question was about the perception of time (is it relatively different between human beings and flies), so I think we are all talking about the same thing here.

 

Tormod

[Freethinker]

Originally posted by: Tormod

I never claimed that time changed, only my experience of it. In fact I never even mentioned the word "time", just "slow motion". Of course the perception of time is relative (ask any 5-year old on Christmas eve).

 

Time is relative? You may be on to something there! :-)

 

No you did not use the word "time", but motion requires time. Therefore "slow" motion would indicate a relative shift in the passage of time. Or perhaps a shift in the relative passage of time? Anyway. To say you did not mean to involve time when talking of motion is impossible.

 

I disagree with the separation of experience and perception in this case. They are one and the same to me.

 

Not to me. And on many levels. e.g. some stimulii could be experienced by your body well before you percieve it. Such as the autonomic response when your fingers touch fire. You "experience" AND "react" pulling your hand away, BEFORE your mind consciously percieves it.

 

Your body could experience an operation and you have no perception of it.

 

As far as I can understand rileyj's original question was about the perception of time (is it relatively different between human beings and flies), so I think we are all talking about the same thing here.

 

I think a bigger question than a relative difference in the PERCEPTION of time, is whether a fly "PERCIEVES" time anyway. To perceive time, one must percieve self.

[Tim_Lou]

all the functions and life spam of flies are much shorter and faster then humans, and they react way faster than us. thus, flies experience a "slower" time.

 

humans as a "bigger" being have more complex sturctures and need more time to communicate between different body parts, reaction time is increased and time seems to be "faster".

 

as Tormod's experience, i guess its because the brain sent some message to tell the body to react faster...... i dont know....

[Freethinker]

Tim_lou, The original question was related to a flies PERCEPTION of time. I question whether a fly CAN "perceive" time. In order to perceive time, one must percieve self.

[Tormod]

"In order to perceive time, one must percieve self. "

 

Freethinker, that is a claim which I think requires some proof.

 

Tormod

[Tormod]

Originally posted by: Freethinker

Time is relative? You may be on to something there! :-)

 

No you did not use the word "time", but motion requires time. Therefore "slow" motion would indicate a relative shift in the passage of time. Or perhaps a shift in the relative passage of time? Anyway. To say you did not mean to involve time when talking of motion is impossible.

 

Well, as this boils down to a pedantic "wrong phrase" discussion, at least I can point out that I said "the *perception* of time is relative", not that time is relative.

 

We are talking about experiences which are *not* extaordinary (nobody here has argued that anything supernatural has happened). They show that we can percieve/experience/feel (however you prefer it) that the passage of time (form our point of reference, yes) has changed.

 

Yet none of us claim that these experiences DO change time, only our perception of it's passage - or more precise, that it is possible to have experiences in which you find that events pass more slowly (or quicker, I'm sure) than usual.

 

Sorry but I fail to see that your arguments cast any light on this matter other than telling us that the experiences were natural, which we all agree that they were.

 

Tormod

[Tormod]

As for insects and plants having a sense of self, here is some food for thought:

 

http://www.calacademy.org/calwild/2002fall/stories/counterpoints.html

 

It is a short essay on signs of perception of different kinds of self in animals and plants.

 

Tormod

[rileyj]

"experienced in slow motion" is relative. There is nothing about time that allows one individual control over it's passing."

 

if one was traveling close to the speed of light then time would move slower for that person compared to someone on earth.

[rileyj]

"It would be more accurate to say that the frame of reference changed, and that it was PECEPTION, not TIME that changed."

 

that's what this is about "perception of time".

[rileyj]

Tim_lou, The original question was related to a flies PERCEPTION of time. I question whether a fly CAN "perceive" time. In order to perceive time, one must percieve self.

 

this is wrong,in order to understand time one must percieve time. animals percieve time as we do they just dont know of it. timing is very important when hunting or being hunted. theypercive the world as we do in their own way. how does the tiger know when to strick? he knows because he waits for the right moment. waiting requiers passing of time. therefore he know to wait, andknows when it is TIME to attack

[rileyj]

"nobody here has argued that anything supernatural has happened"

 

supernatural is something that doesn't normal happen. like when we percieve time to pass slower in times of great stress. we do not control this ourselves,and can not make it happen at will. surely if one could control this. and have faster than normal reaction time at will,it would be percieved as supernatural