Smokinjoe9 Posted May 19, 2005 Report Share Posted May 19, 2005 We have recently discussed the idea that both good and evil are mental constucts that are highly subjective. IE if God is good, he is a mental construct and highly subjective. I am sorry, I am just subracting a "o" from the word good... :shrug: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bumab Posted May 19, 2005 Report Share Posted May 19, 2005 We have recently discussed the idea that both good and evil are mental constucts that are highly subjective. IE if God is good, he is a mental construct and highly subjective. Assuming we agree with that definition of Good and evil, I suppose. Evil doesn't have to be a "thing" or personified in anyway. "Evil" can simply be described as the absence of good as well, as in darkness is the absence of light. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bumab Posted May 19, 2005 Report Share Posted May 19, 2005 Anyway, back to the topic. There is another option to the "what is God" question. As far as your questions, Orb, I think the whole gender thing is really a non-issue. The Biblical record uses many alagories to get it's point across, classifying God as a "He" was really meant to characterize a trait of God, which was the leader. At the time and culture, that was what men did. So natural, "Father" was ascribed to Him. Mother is also a useful term, as in source of life, sustinence (metaphorically, of course), etc etc. Many people say "God is above gender." More later, got to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishteacher73 Posted May 19, 2005 Report Share Posted May 19, 2005 Historically in english the masculine was also used as a colective pronoun. The use of man, he, him, etc. was used inplace of the current pc standard of the he/she construction. Essentially it is a shift in grammar (Check the US Constitution). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biochemist Posted May 19, 2005 Report Share Posted May 19, 2005 Orb- Where did you go? You abandoned you own thread. (spanks are in order) Are you interested in a (undoubtedly long) discussion of what the Trinity is? This is the larger topic of "is God a man/human" and will predictably get confusing and (probably) quite fun. You game for this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishteacher73 Posted May 19, 2005 Report Share Posted May 19, 2005 An intesting site discussing the concept of the trinity in the LDS. A reasonably logical and precise page.http://users2.ev1.net/~kcmake/lds/TwoMen/TwoMen.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biochemist Posted May 19, 2005 Report Share Posted May 19, 2005 An intesting site discussing the concept of the trinity in the LDS. A reasonably logical and precise page.http://users2.ev1.net/~kcmake/lds/TwoMen/TwoMen.htmlInteresting page. It is pretty good about explaining some views of 2/3 of the Trinity, but leave out any reference to the last third (the spirit). The author also seems to imply that some significant fraction of Christians do not beleive this. I am not sure what the LDs implications are that the author is trying to support. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishteacher73 Posted May 19, 2005 Report Share Posted May 19, 2005 Mormons split God/jesus and the holy spirit. Why, I am not really sure, but basically the the holy spirit is omnipresent while the other two are not is my understanding... (I had fun w/ the missionaries trying to convert me. My ex and her family was mormon...they really didn't know what to do with an atheist.. :shrug: ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffy Posted May 19, 2005 Report Share Posted May 19, 2005 It is pretty good about explaining some views of 2/3 of the Trinity, but leave out any reference to the last third (the spirit).Tee hee! That spirit is a pretty controversial gal!The author also seems to imply that some significant fraction of Christians do not beleive this. I am not sure what the LDs implications are that the author is trying to support.I have not touched the Book of Mormon since high school, but its a recommended read if you want to understand some of the more interesting uniquely American offshoots of Christianity. I find it similar to Baptist teachings because its got similar roots, but its all in one place, whereas tracking down the variations of Baptist thought can be a long investigative experience. Its been a while since I've looked at this topic so I'm rusty, but I seem to remember a rough (*not* absolute) correlation between holy spirit emphasis and elevation of miracles within sectarian doctrine. The old sects--Catholics and Orthodox--as well as the "new" sects--Pentacostals, Evangelicals, etc.--all go for it. More conservative mainstream Protestants don't, and I think that in Mormonism there are significant issues that have to do with the Joseph Smith as prophet conflicting with traditional Holy Spirit dogma. I dunno for sure though. Cheers,Buffy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffy Posted May 19, 2005 Report Share Posted May 19, 2005 I had fun w/ the missionaries trying to convert me. My ex and her family was mormon...they really didn't know what to do with an atheist.. :oLots of Mormons in LA, and prolly 10% of my high school class went to the "University of California at Provo" :shrug: (they actually produce shirts that say that!). They're some of the nicest people I've *ever* met, and they really don't like to try to convert you if you don't want to be converted, although I think if you marry into the family, the pressure is a lot higher... Cheers,Buffy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEAKER Posted May 19, 2005 Report Share Posted May 19, 2005 But its interesting that the Greek word for person there denotes an individual. Its like saying that Christ was the outwardly expressed image of the individual who is God. But then again that's the whole idea behind the Word in the first chapter of John also. The Word, Logos, in the Greek is an outward expression of an inward thought, etc.Hey Paul, I think you did a pretty great job defining fundamental Christianity in a nutshell!:o Orb, you're way too uptight about the whole God issue. I understand your frustration with some of the people who "speak for God"; but as for me, I always try to get down to the nitty gritty: beyond all the bs; if there is a God, and if the bible is true; God created man and woman to be His friends not His enemies. If you think you understand love at all, realize that the greatest love you could ever feel or experience, can only dimly mirror the unspeakale love of the Creator. Reguardless of all the crappy examples of evil in the world that you might want to throw at me, that's not the way God intended it to be. Chill out dude. Understanding anything never works as well if you're already assuming you can't understand it anyway; so why try. What kind of musician would you be if you had that attitude about your music?:shrug: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infamous Posted May 19, 2005 Report Share Posted May 19, 2005 Interesting page. It is pretty good about explaining some views of 2/3 of the Trinity, but leave out any reference to the last third (the spirit). The author also seems to imply that some significant fraction of Christians do not beleive this. I am not sure what the LDs implications are that the author is trying to support.Hey there Bio; I have a thought for you if your game? When you contemplate the nature of man, one could break down our existence into three parts. The first would be the physical, that is the body itself. The second would be the mind, and that would be, of course, our thoughts, plans, and our world view. The third would be, that is if you have faith, your spirit. The essence of self that is eternal. I've often heard people say, "I just can't understand how the trinity could be possible". Not being able to rationalize the existence of three entities within one being, they confuse the issue by trying to bring three separate beings into one. I don't find it hard to understand at all because for me is analogous to the example I gave about man himself. If God exists, and I think you know how I feel about that question, his existence may be constructed in basically the same fashion. God equals the mind, plan, if you will. Jesus equals that essence placed in a body, human form. The Holy Spirit is that eternal presence within all things material or otherwise. Think about it??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biochemist Posted May 19, 2005 Report Share Posted May 19, 2005 ...God equals the mind, plan, if you will. Jesus equals that essence placed in a body, human form. The Holy Spirit is that eternal presence within all things material or otherwise. ...This is a reasonable view, Inf, but I suspect (like most/all Trinity models), it probably misses some of the complexity. I don't pretend to understand the Trinity. It is worth noting that the Trinity per se is an extra-Biblical construct. We have created this idea because we had a difficult time reconciling a host of Biblical references. Personally, I think it is reasonable that descriptions of the nature of God are complicated. It doesn't matter whether we are talking about God's love vs His justice, His sovereignty vs His granting our free will, His forgiveness vs His judgement, His intimacy vs His omnipresence; all of these are complicated and fundamentally inexplicable. I think it is reasonable that God would be as complicated as His creation is. It does not make sense that God would be simple. I think simple religions (e.g., Hunduism) are antithetical because they are so straightforward. Basically, I am saying that it makes sense that God doesn't make any sense. Quantum physics doesn't make any sense (e.g., the two slit experiment) but we take it at face value. That things do not make sense is not a reason to reject them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eMTee Posted May 20, 2005 Report Share Posted May 20, 2005 god is anything you want it to be..you can travel the globe, and you will not find a single person that doesn't have one. From an invisible power to the grass on your lawn. I am a Christian, I believe in only one God, and he is the maker of all things, he is the one that deserved the credit..and he is the only way to Heaven..God it too great to explain what he is in a single lifetime, God is God..and I don't think the God of the Bible is another made up god. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queso Posted May 20, 2005 Author Report Share Posted May 20, 2005 this thread must be closed, way off topic. blah blah blah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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