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What Is Consciousness?


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#18 Thoth101

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 05:00 AM

Yes I am a Transhumanist and a Supremacist, I believe in the evolution of mankind to a state of supreme perfection being God-like being superior to all previous versions of humanity. There will be no Black or White or Asian or etc. only God-like and not God-like. Those that have transcended and those inferior people that have not. Flesh and Bone and Machine and Nanotechnology and Genetic Engineering, all merged into one to make the Homo-superior.

 

Well atleast you are brutally honest. The question is if you become like that what will you fight against when their is nothing left? Will these Homo-Superior beings just fight each other? All the normal humans and most animals will be pretty much obliterated. I mean would you plan on going on other planets and taking them over after this one is destroyed?



#19 VictorMedvil

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 05:16 AM

Well atleast you are brutally honest. The question is if you become like that what will you fight against when their is nothing left? Will these Homo-Superior beings just fight each other? All the normal humans and most animals will be pretty much obliterated. I mean would you plan on going on other planets and taking them over after this one is destroyed?

There could be Blood shed, there could be extinction of species, none of that matters in the grand scheme of things. The Ultimate Goal of any civilization should be to achieve kardashev scale tier 5 and rule an entire universe, that is the dream to conquer the entire universe. Either the aliens will join us on our quest for dominance or be crushed before the collective might of those that have vision and join us. To have a billion-trillion worlds at our disposal and under control that should be the ultimate goal, one planet is insignificant compared to what we should hope to achieve in the cosmological epochs ahead in space, but this requires that we work towards a common goal of doing exactly that, we only weaken ourselves and the enemy by fighting, the species of the Milky Way should join together toward this common goal rather than fight but first humans should join together as one group with a common goal, but those that will not join shall be crushed.


Edited by VictorMedvil, 21 February 2020 - 05:27 AM.


#20 Thoth101

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 05:27 AM

There could be Blood shed, there could be extinction of species, none of that matters in the grand scheme of things. The Ultimate Goal of any civilization should be to achieve kardashev scale tier 5 and rule an entire universe, that is the dream to conquer the entire universe. Either the aliens will join us on our quest for dominance or be crushed before the collective might of those that have vision and join us.

 

I think that is what Yahweh if he was real tried to do. He wanted to be the most powerful God of them all and have everyone follow him. They couldn't have any other Gods but him. Do you really want to be like him? And I ask where is he at now if he did exist? I think the more highly organically evolved entites aren't out to take over worlds but to help worlds live and thrive peacefully. That would be what is known as the Galactic Federation. If you want to be warlke and take over worlds you would want to get with the Dracos the warlike Reptilians that are more negative in nature.



#21 VictorMedvil

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 05:31 AM

I think that is what Yahweh if he was real tried to do. He wanted to be the most powerful God of them all and have everyone follow him. They couldn't have any other Gods but him. Do you really want to be like him? And I ask where is he at now if he did exist? I think the more highly organically evolved entites aren't out to take over worlds but to help worlds live and thrive peacefully. That would be what is known as the Galactic Federation. If you want to be warlke and take over worlds you would want to get with the Dracos the warlike Reptilians that are more negative in nature.

Maybe there is a path somewhere between the two that is the correct one for humanity, not quite a federation and not quite a reptilian but somewhere right in the middle, maybe the Slogan "Join us Or die" was not fully understood by you. Do you understand that the best path is not to be so warlike that you lose allies but to be warlike enough to defeat enemies that seek you harm?


Edited by VictorMedvil, 21 February 2020 - 05:57 AM.


#22 Thoth101

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 05:39 AM

Maybe there is a path somewhere between the two that is the correct one for humanity, not quite a federation and not quite a reptilian but somewhere right in the middle, maybe the Sloan "Join us Or die" was not fully understood by you.

 

According to some their are already humans that are more evolved and those are called the Pleadians. Some are saying now that the Greys or Zitas are us from a future timeline if we take the Transhumanism route. They are coming back to a time in history they can get our DNA because the lost all functionality to reproduce. So they are developing hybrids to try and get their organic form of human back unto their future timeline. I don't know for sure but that sounds like a possibility. Surly something to think about.



#23 VictorMedvil

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 06:00 AM

According to some their are already humans that are more evolved and those are called the Pleadians. Some are saying now that the Greys or Zitas are us from a future timeline if we take the Transhumanism route. They are coming back to a time in history they can get our DNA because the lost all functionality to reproduce. So they are developing hybrids to try and get their organic form of human back unto their future timeline. I don't know for sure but that sounds like a possibility. Surly something to think about.

I dunno about any of that, however I do know that we will find species that will join us on our quest in the universe, we will need friends to create a universe empire but however will need soldiers too and undoubtedly will gain enemies over time.


Edited by VictorMedvil, 21 February 2020 - 06:06 AM.


#24 Flummoxed

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 09:22 AM

I think science holds to key to "real immortality" not fake stuff preached by preachers and religious figures to get you to put money in their offering boxes. There has never been any conclusive proof of any afterlife thus in absence to any proof I tend to think it is false. However, Biological Immortality and Digital Immortality have all the proof in the world behind them for instance if you fix your genetic code you will not age or make a copy of your brain patterns you will be stored inside a computer that sort of thing makes much more sense to me. Unlike what the religious text says achieving immortality is not the easy or "Free".

 

 

Getting back to the consciousness, and away from world/universal domination, which I think comes from the evil emperor in star wars. 

 

Is consciousness defined by just existing, or do you have to be awake. Digital immortality ? contained in computers, how about quantum computers ? Is the universe not one big automatic quantum computer. Your information may already be encoded for eternity, or at least part of it.

 

 

 

I think all information is stored and remembered in your overall soul. Think of it this way. Your body is like your spacesuit to your consciousness. You are in it but after awhile that spacesuit will wear out. Your consciousness will then move on. I think there is a process when you leave the body from this experience and you go into that dimension more then likely the 4th dimension and you ask yourself what have I learned from this experience? 

 

What is your soul. Is it not a religious thing that can be sent to hell or heaven to scare children. 

Quantum computers / the universe might contain a record of what is your essence, in another timeless dimension. That essence might be able to move around perhaps.

You might ask yourself if said explanations work. do I want to do that again? :). The Problem being reborn as a child would mean you would have to learn from all those mistakes again, and dont think there is any conceivable way a dead person could transfer their knowledge into another body. People with brain trauma lose huge chunks of their brain function including memories, so to function as we are, you need a functioning brain. Your thoughts do not make up what might be your essence. In religious terms this would be a soul/spirit/ghost/ etc 

 

Any one like ghost stories. There are many mansion houses near where I used to live, one of my friends had got himself a job as a live in gardener and lived in the stables, of this mansion house. The lord of the manor was out, so he invited us all around for a look and party. He gave us a guided tour at about midnight, around most of the house, culminating in the disused chapel. We had left all the doors open behind us along this corridor, it was quite a warm night. We opened the door to the morgue. As we each stepped into and out of the morgue the temperature dropped and the hairs went up on the back of the neck. Then it started, the doors we had left open started banging shut, slowly at first then accelerating down the corridor. We vacated the chapel through the open windows, and went back to the stables to party some. The next thing we hear are hob nail boots coming down the stairs where there was no one. Again the temperature dropped. My friend handed his notice in shortly after, he had a nervous disposition. :)

 

Another story ref an apparent Poltergeist. A boyfriend of one of my older female friends, was helping her baby sit. The child was young and frightened that the poltergeist in that house would throw something. So when it came for the boyfriend to leave he said I will take the ghost with me. Driving home in hs car when he looked in the rear view mirror was a apparition. He stopped his car got out. the apparition disappeared.

 

+ many more stories. 

 

Edit I forgot where I was headed with this line of reasoning. Is there any way that any part of your information could be passed from A to B via entanglement to anothe point in space time. Again I am thinking non locality.


Edited by Flummoxed, 21 February 2020 - 09:25 AM.

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#25 VictorMedvil

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 09:33 AM

Getting back to the consciousness, and away from world/universal domination, which I think comes from the evil emperor in star wars. 

 

Is consciousness defined by just existing, or do you have to be awake. Digital immortality ? contained in computers, how about quantum computers ? Is the universe not one big automatic quantum computer. Your information may already be encoded for eternity, or at least part of it.

 

 

 

What is your soul. Is it not a religious thing that can be sent to hell or heaven to scare children. 

Quantum computers / the universe might contain a record of what is your essence, in another timeless dimension. That essence might be able to move around perhaps.

You might ask yourself if said explanations work. do I want to do that again? :). The Problem being reborn as a child would mean you would have to learn from all those mistakes again, and dont think there is any conceivable way a dead person could transfer their knowledge into another body. People with brain trauma lose huge chunks of their brain function including memories, so to function as we are, you need a functioning brain. Your thoughts do not make up what might be your essence. In religious terms this would be a soul/spirit/ghost/ etc 

 

Any one like ghost stories. There are many mansion houses near where I used to live, one of my friends had got himself a job as a live in gardener and lived in the stables, of this mansion house. The lord of the manor was out, so he invited us all around for a look and party. He gave us a guided tour at about midnight, around most of the house, culminating in the disused chapel. We had left all the doors open behind us along this corridor, it was quite a warm night. We opened the door to the morgue. As we each stepped into and out of the morgue the temperature dropped and the hairs went up on the back of the neck. Then it started, the doors we had left open started banging shut, slowly at first then accelerating down the corridor. We vacated the chapel through the open windows, and went back to the stables to party some. The next thing we hear are hob nail boots coming down the stairs where there was no one. Again the temperature dropped. My friend handed his notice in shortly after, he had a nervous disposition. :)

 

Another story ref an apparent Poltergeist. A boyfriend of one of my older female friends, was helping her baby sit. The child was young and frightened that the poltergeist in that house would throw something. So when it came for the boyfriend to leave he said I will take the ghost with me. Driving home in hs car when he looked in the rear view mirror was a apparition. He stopped his car got out. the apparition disappeared.

 

+ many more stories. 

 

Edit I forgot where I was headed with this line of reasoning. Is there any way that any part of your information could be passed from A to B via entanglement to anothe point in space time. Again I am thinking non locality.

Yes but after your information decays once your brain stops functioning that doesn't really matter much that the universe stored it, just as once the universe ends in the big rip or thermal death what happens to your information then? To say that is actually quite silly as like dead people right once they are dead, the brain rots away how are you going to reconstruct their pattern from the universe? We are no more than neurons firing in a certain pattern once that pattern is lost, it's gone forever unless the data of the pattern is stored in something which is why the universe cannot possibly store that pattern after your brain rots, that universe storage has decayed at that point to say the universe doesn't store it other than the physical pattern it processes.


Edited by VictorMedvil, 21 February 2020 - 09:38 AM.


#26 Flummoxed

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 10:00 AM

Yes but after your information decays once your brain stops functioning that doesn't really matter much that the universe stored it, just as once the universe ends in the big rip or thermal death what happens to your information then? To say that is actually quite silly as like dead people right once they are dead, the brain rots away how are you going to reconstruct their pattern from the universe? We are no more than neurons firing in a certain pattern once that pattern is lost, it's gone forever unless the data of the pattern is stored in something which is why the universe cannot possibly store that pattern after your brain rots, that universe storage has decayed at that point to say the universe doesn't store it other than the physical pattern it processes.

 

You missed the point, probably due to my poor grammar, what I am driving at is after this physical body is dead, and your brain is defunct, ie all memories wiped. Could an essence of something like a quantum memory exist via effects observed in non locality throughout all of time. Playing on Thoths writings on being the Alpha and the Omega :)  

 

Those firing neurons may be "entangled to a certain extent" ( Feyman) and may pass some information else where, perhaps to another point in space time, which might be more inviting than rotting in a corpse, or getting cremated :) 

 

Just remembered where I read "as above it is below" previously mentioned by Thoth101. It was Hermes Trismegistus https://www.goodread...es_Trismegistus thought by some to be a reincarnation of Thoth which happens every 2000 years or so apparently. 

 

“Birth is not the beginning of life - only of an individual awareness. Change into another state is not death - only the ending of this awareness.” Hermes


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#27 Dubbelosix

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 10:37 AM

Yes but after your information decays once your brain stops functioning that doesn't really matter much that the universe stored it, just as once the universe ends in the big rip or thermal death what happens to your information then? To say that is actually quite silly as like dead people right once they are dead, the brain rots away how are you going to reconstruct their pattern from the universe? We are no more than neurons firing in a certain pattern once that pattern is lost, it's gone forever unless the data of the pattern is stored in something which is why the universe cannot possibly store that pattern after your brain rots, that universe storage has decayed at that point to say the universe doesn't store it other than the physical pattern it processes.


Being subsystems of the universe, do you really think our memories and actions truly are... Meaningless...? Nothing happens for no reason, no more than the universe needed lots of space so that conscious beings could exist. We are not some unfortunate by-product, at least in my opinion, we are the universe expressing itself in a unique way.

Edited by Dubbelosix, 21 February 2020 - 10:37 AM.

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#28 VictorMedvil

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 10:41 AM

Being subsystems of the universe, do you really think our memories and actions truly are... Meaningless...? Nothing happens for no reason, no more than the universe needed lots of space so that conscious beings could exist. We are not some unfortunate by-product, at least in my opinion, we are the universe expressing itself in a unique way.

Well its not meaningless however I highly doubt that there is any storage of the patterns besides the physical patterning be processed as quarks, atoms, and etc. Once that pattern is lost you are gone from any reclamation by the universe, you have at that point become something else such as dirt. The universe may be expressing itself in a unique way but it by no means is intentional, life was just random molecular fluctuations that created us. The purpose of living beings is no more fundamentally then to create life itself and reproduce, just as the purpose of the universe is to expand and process energy-mass, which by random energy fluctuations created everything from the planets to us.


Edited by VictorMedvil, 21 February 2020 - 10:50 AM.


#29 Dubbelosix

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 11:13 AM

Gone? I can see what you think, but did you not come into existence because of these particles? Did the universe not drive the engine of creation so that you could exist? And do you feel so strongly that death is the final adventure, as Captain Hook said?

#30 Dubbelosix

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 11:15 AM

The way I see it, is that I came here through fundamental influences, and I don't see any reason why I cannot return. There are in fact many compelling cases of afterlifes for instance which are well documented under scientific rigor.
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#31 Flummoxed

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 11:40 AM

Being subsystems of the universe, do you really think our memories and actions truly are... Meaningless...? Nothing happens for no reason, no more than the universe needed lots of space so that conscious beings could exist. We are not some unfortunate by-product, at least in my opinion, we are the universe expressing itself in a unique way.

 

I tend to think along the lines of automatons, responding to external inputs. I wouldnt be writing this if you hadnt wrote the above.

 

The way I see it, is that I came here through fundamental influences, and I don't see any reason why I cannot return. There are in fact many compelling cases of afterlifes for instance which are well documented under scientific rigor.

 

What verified documented cases? verified by who, and how.

 

I am aware of people who have organ transplants taking on the hobbies of the donor. For example someone who hates football suddenly becoming a fanatic. No recorded memories are transferred as far as I am aware of, just enthusiasms. 



#32 Dubbelosix

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 01:05 PM

I tend to think along the lines of automatons, responding to external inputs. I wouldnt be writing this if you hadnt wrote the above.
 

 
What verified documented cases? verified by who, and how.
 
I am aware of people who have organ transplants taking on the hobbies of the donor. For example someone who hates football suddenly becoming a fanatic. No recorded memories are transferred as far as I am aware of, just enthusiasms.



Well there are a number of documented cases of children remembering past lives and where studied by scientific researchers. You may be able to find a good documentary on YouTube... Heck, I'll find it for you.
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#33 Dubbelosix

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 01:07 PM

https://m.youtube.co...h?v=Uq8l4XVfgPA


There was quite a few that came up but here is a good.
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#34 Flummoxed

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 02:37 PM

https://m.youtube.co...h?v=Uq8l4XVfgPA


There was quite a few that came up but here is a good.

 

Interesting I'll raise you 52mins and 30seconds in to this link  https://www.youtube....h?v=S7SQoQj9868 it gets interesting. 

 

Your link suggests memories might be transferred, memories are contained in the brain, 

 

Feelings of peace can be achieved by reduced oxygen intake. Out of body experience, astral projection, ghosts. Same thing maybe :shocked: .

 

If you are dead and want to be reborn. Head for the maternity ward or find a fertile looking young lady, and wait for her boy friend to come along and get her pregnant.

 

Where can I get some Ayahuaska.


Edited by Flummoxed, 21 February 2020 - 02:38 PM.