Evolution Must Be Taught in Public Schools

[Galapagos]

Florida Citizens for Science Blog Archive Judiciary review

 

I don't know what to say about this. I'm a Floridian, and tomorrow our Senate Judiciary Committee is meeting to decide on whether or not to pass the "academics freedom act".

Here are some excerpts from the meeting packet quoted in the above blog:

 

The bill is silent on who determines whether the teacher’s presentation on scientific information meets the definition and is therefore afforded protection under the act. Presumably, the determination would be made by the school district, but this is not stated. Additionally, the definition appears to encompass a wide range of information within the protected presentation by the teacher. The bill suggests that the only requirement is that the information is relevant to the science standards pertaining to evolution, and that the information is presented objectively. Again the bill is silent on who defines the objectivity of the scientific information presented. The administration and the teacher may have different views on the objectiveness of the information presented.

 

It is unclear under the bill if a student’s performance in a science class will be measured upon his or her own view or position on evolution, or by a consistent standard applied to each student. The ambiguity may create unanticipated problems with student evaluation and grading in science classes.

 

It should also be noted that, because evolution and countervailing theories are subject to intense controversy, objective presentation of scientific information critical of the theory of evolution may be difficult to achieve in the classroom. If at any point objectivity is abandoned, it is possible that a court could determine that the state is promoting religion in violation of the Establishment Clause.

While a student maintains free speech rights, as indicated above, those rights are not without limitation. It appears that this provision in the bill may be interpreted to expand the rights of students in excess of the First Amendment.

 

A teacher’s statements in class during instructional periods are part of the curriculum and regular class activity and thus subject to reasonable speech regulation.

At best, it just seems like a tremendous waste of our tax dollars to even discuss something so ridiculous. At worst, the minds of thousands(probably more like millions) of children are going to be systematically stifled.

[HydrogenBond]

I discussed this in another evolution and ID discussion; it has to do with the very first assumption of evolution, and why it is not possible. That first assumption has to do with the random appearance of first life.

 

If you look at life, one thing that is different about life, compared to inanimate matter such as rocks, is life gains energy value. For example, if we compare a seedling to a tree, the final state of the tree stores more energy value. The rest of nature moves toward lowest energy. While life moves in the direction of increasing energy.

 

What that implies is, at the inception of life, the random life inception event not only had to assemble the bio-materials to make life, it had to do that in an environment that was totally geared toward lowering energy. What that implies is the earth would be aborting the early energy gaining affects of life such that the unlikely random event would have to occur a bunch of times at a bunch of steps in the process, making random unlikely.

 

In other words, if we assume an inert earth, the formation of life might occur randomly, since as it forms, it can remain in that state for further steps toward evolution in the direction of increasing energy. But if we include an earth that is moving everything else toward lower energy, this countering potential is getting stronger and stronger, relative to the growing life, causing an increasing potential for reversal at each additional step. Unless there is a logical potential that keeps overcoming this countering potential, it would require a large number of random events at many steps in the process, such that the probability gets almost impossible. This interactive dynamics suggests the need for a logical potential that will keep trying, via natural law, until it gets over the hump to make life. Evolution is built upon a cornerstone of improbability.

[Galapagos]

Bad news in Florida:

Florida Citizens for Science Blog Archive An early account of what happened

 

In a move that now sends the deceptively named “academic freedom” bill to the Florida Senate floor, the Senate judiciary committee voted 6-3 to approve it.

Florida Citizens for Science Blog Archive Media Alert

TALLAHASSEE, Fla. – Florida Citizens for Science and a coalition of stellar science organizations will present an exciting roundtable discussion on current legislative threats to science curriculum in Florida’s public schools. The panelists will address why the so-called “Evolution Academic Freedom Act” introduced in the state House and Senate is bad for science education in Florida and the growth of Florida’s economy

 

WHO: Florida Citizens for Science and coalition members

 

WHAT: Roundtable Discussion with the following:

> Dave Campbell, high school science teacher

> Maryann Fiala, Executive Director, American electronics Alliance (AeA) Florida Council

> Dr. Harold Kroto, Nobel Prize Winner Chemistry 1996, Florida State University Dept. of Chemistry and Biochemistry

> Vic Walczak, Legal Director, ACLU of Pennsylvania, Lawyer in 2005 landmark case Kitzmiller v. Dover Area School District challenging the teaching of intelligent design in public schools.

> Ann Lunsden - Dr Lansden is professor of biology at FSU. She is a past president of the National Association of Biology Teachers.

...

 

The event is an opportunity for the community to address the bill, which singles out evolution for special treatment and exposes school districts to liability if teachers and students inject their religious beliefs into the science classroom in the guise of “science.” This bill takes control of the curriculum away from education professionals. It is a red herring designed to suggest that discrimination exists where it does not, and to draw attention away from the subject matter of creationism. No law is required to authorize the teaching of scientific fact.

 

Participating organizations: American Society for Human Genetics (ASHG), American Association of Anatomists (AAA), American Society for Biochemistry and Molecular Biology (ASBMB), Genetics Society of America (GSA), National Association of Biology Teachers (NABT), and Society for Developmental Biology (SDB).

 

[REASON]

Evolution is built upon a cornerstone of improbability.

 

And your post is supported by a foundation of Communion Wafers.

[Essay]

I discussed this in another evolution and ID discussion; it has to do with the very first assumption of evolution, and why it is not possible. That first assumption has to do with the random appearance of first life.

 

If you look at life, one thing that is different about life, compared to inanimate matter such as rocks, is life gains energy value. For example, if we compare a seedling to a tree, the final state of the tree stores more energy value. The rest of nature moves toward lowest energy. While life moves in the direction of increasing energy.

 

What that implies is, at the inception of life, the random life inception event not only had to assemble the bio-materials to make life, it had to do that in an environment that was totally geared toward lowering energy. What that implies is the earth would be aborting the early energy gaining affects of life such that the unlikely random event would have to occur a bunch of times at a bunch of steps in the process, making random unlikely.

 

In other words, if we assume an inert earth, the formation of life might occur randomly, since as it forms, it can remain in that state for further steps toward evolution in the direction of increasing energy. But if we include an earth that is moving everything else toward lower energy, this countering potential is getting stronger and stronger, relative to the growing life, causing an increasing potential for reversal at each additional step. Unless there is a logical potential that keeps overcoming this countering potential, it would require a large number of random events at many steps in the process, such that the probability gets almost impossible. This interactive dynamics suggests the need for a logical potential that will keep trying, via natural law, until it gets over the hump to make life. Evolution is built upon a cornerstone of improbability.

What does evolution have to do with the origin of life?

 

 

HydrogenBond,

This is sorta off-topic, but I've enjoyed your thoughts and observations about entropy. I think this idea has much more to do with the origin of life than we realize; but as noted, this is pretty off-topic on a thread about evolution. Someone should start an "Entropy & Life's Origin" thread. :)

 

IMO... :)

When thinking about these ideas, you always need to 'kill off' all the life before looking at net changes (closing the system). This zero's out the negative entropy of life.

 

But...

Metabolism ultimately converts sunlight into food, and again into usable energy, plus lost heat.

All along the metabolic pathways, there is lost heat (entropy).

Turning light into heat is an inescapable net result of metabolism.

 

It is not life itself, but the process of living that achieves a net entropy gain.

:)

[Galapagos]

Atheist Nation | Atheist Videos | Flying Spaghetti Monster Expelled | Video 01159

 

 

FSM expelled parody video. kinda funny.

[Essay]

Atheist Nation | Atheist Videos | Flying Spaghetti Monster Expelled | Video 01159

 

 

FSM expelled parody video. kinda funny.

 

Yes, thanks.

It was very faithful to Ben's trailer.

 

....linked to that clip was:

Atheist Nation | Atheist Videos | Sam Harris makes a joke and a point. | Video 01168

 

I wish I could see the whole discussion!

:phones: :sleep: :lol:

[Galapagos]

Yes, thanks.

It was very faithful to Ben's trailer.

 

....linked to that clip was:

Atheist Nation | Atheist Videos | Sam Harris makes a joke and a point. | Video 01168

 

I wish I could see the whole discussion!

:phones: :sleep: :lol:

'Sam Harris debate with Rabbi David Wolpe' by American Jewish University - RichardDawkins.net

 

This is one of my favorite Harris debates. Enjoy.

[Essay]

'Sam Harris debate with Rabbi David Wolpe' by American Jewish University - RichardDawkins.net

 

This is one of my favorite Harris debates. Enjoy.

 

Wow! Thanks....

 

I was just thinking about the clip.

It's an interesting question that comes up in this Sam Harris discussion.

What happens when religious dogma conflicts with scientific dogma?

 

I've been trying to approach these questions with a reconciliatory view.

If, as a human, one can try to "translate" the contrary view into a non-threatening framework, then interesting new questions arise; the debate might progress.

 

For instance:

The Earth is 6000 years old!

Hmmmm, okay; but you know that G0d laid down all this "evidence" that tells us about how the planet changes over time. Was this to fool us, or to inform us?

What we should be debating (with religious people) is whether or not to use these clues that G0d gave us to help save humanity and the Creation.

 

Humans didn't "evolve" from Apes!

Hmmmm, okay; but you know that G0d made Apes (and other mammals, life, etc.) similar enough to Humans that we can learn a lot about our physiology, diseases, and metabolism from them.

We should be debating whether or not to use this knowledge to help save humanity and the Creation.

 

If scientists could try to view religious dogma as a system of jargon to be translated into more familiar jargon, then maybe the conversation could progress onto more meaningful, rewarding questions and goals.

 

I know this could be unrealistic depending on the people, laws, or other circumstances involved; but occasionally this might be an available option. :phones:

 

:sleep:

Well, I'll have to watch the whole deal, eh?

Thanks again!

[InfiniteNow]

So, the movie was released. PZ Myers, the blogger behind Pharyngula, and a professor at the University of Minnesota was almost arrested when he tried to attend a showing of Ben Stein's anti-Evolution movie Expelled.

 

However, they completely missed his guest in true and classic myopic creationist... erm... cdesign proponentsists... style.

 

See here (scan down to where the text begins to enjoy the fun):

 

Pharyngula: EXPELLED!

 

 

Oh... The irony, the side-splitting, milk coming out of my nose irony.

 

He was expelled from the movie expelled, but they let his friend enter...

 

His friend was Richard Dawkins... You can read his account of events here:

 

'Lying for Jesus?' by Richard Dawkins - RichardDawkins.net

 

 

 

YouTube - Discussion on PZ Myers being expelled from Expelled http://youtube.com/watch?v=c39jYgsvUOY

[InfiniteNow]

'Sam Harris debate with Rabbi David Wolpe' by American Jewish University - RichardDawkins.net

 

This is one of my favorite Harris debates. Enjoy.

 

This was quite good. Thank you.

[InfiniteNow]

http://www.expelledexposed.com/

 

Flunked, Not Expelled:

What Ben Stein isn't telling

you about Intelligent Design

Welcome to Expelled Exposed, a detailed look at the Ben Stein movie Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed. We'll show you why this movie is not a documentary at all, but anti-science propaganda aimed at creating the appearance of controversy where there is none.

 

To learn why the claims made in Expelled are false, find out The Truth behind the Fiction. For information on the producers and their actions, go Behind the Scenes. To learn more about evolution and intelligent design, or to see what other people thought of Expelled, view our links to other online Resources.

 

 

 

Also:

 

Special Report on Human Evolution - New Scientist

[freeztar]

http://www.expelledexposed.com/

 

Link does not work.

[InfiniteNow]

Strange. Works here.

 

I presume you should be able to back door yourself in by clicking the first link here:

 

expelled exposed - Google Search

[freeztar]

Strange. Works here.

 

I presume you should be able to back door yourself in by clicking the first link here:

 

expelled exposed - Google Search

 

No "backdoor" needed.

 

I just tried again and it worked, but I noticed the following message at the top of the page:

 

"The full ExpelledExposed.com site is experiencing particularly high traffic at the moment. We are working to resolve this problem as quickly as possible."

 

So therein lies the source of the problem me thinks. Not a bad problem to have though. :lightning

 

I checked it out and it's all media sources it seems. I read a few and it confirmed what I already preconceived about the movie. I still want to see it though.

The liturgical letters were...er...interesting.

[InfiniteNow]

Has everyone heard of this beautiful little nugget already?

 

 

YouTube - Teacher Expelled Over Religion http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sQacQy1KJ9M

 

 

 

Chris Comer, a Science Teacher in Texas was Expelled for not teaching Intelligent Design in her science class. It's a scary day indeed when our science teachers get fired for recognizing that creationism is not science.

 

We are here to call out Ben Stein and his ludicrous ideas that are the spotlight of his new movie about Intelligent Design. The movie is a manipulation of lies that repackage religious creationism as Intelligent Design and teach it as science in public schools. We must stand up and keeps science out of our public science education.

[InfiniteNow]

Science After Sunclipse Blog Archive Creation, Power and Violence

 

Open your mouth about evolution around the wrong people, though, and you can find yourself harassed, ejected from your job and even beaten in the street.

 

Just ask these people.

 

 

 

...he was fired because he did not teach the story of Adam and Eve as literal truth.

 

 

And another:

 

Her three years as an assistant professor ended with assaults on her integrity and her physical self:

 

 

Maurice Sendak’s award-winning book Where the Wild Things Are was removed from school libraries, as it might “confuse children as to the true nature of Beelzebub.”

 

 

Another:

 

The real occurrence of violence gives death threats a certain cachet of intimidating force. Eric Pianka, a biologist at UT Austin, gave a speech before the Texas Academy of Science, which was presenting him with a distinguished-service award. In his speech, he articulated his fears that overpopulation will lead to a disaster for the human species. The story then took a twist which a fiction writer would be hard-pressed to surpass: a creationist named Forrest Mims claimed that Pianka advocated releasing the Ebola virus to eliminate 90% of the world’s population. Other creationists, like William Dembski, soon picked up the story, leading to online hysteria. Within days, Pianka himself and others in the Texas Academy of Science received death threats.

 

 

 

These people, who have suffered because they accept the scientific truth of evolution, are not raving atheists or infidel interlopers. They learned the hard way that some folks just aren’t satisfied with “theistic evolution,” with the idea that the Creation took a long time or that science and religion answer different kinds of questions. Compromise and coexistence are, quite simply, not good enough. Those who advise such a friendly relationship find themselves, dare I say it, expelled.