Evolution

[Emerald.Eclipse3]

I wonder if theories of evolution are accurate and we are in fact decended from the apes, then why are they still around?

 

I have never questioned this point before, but a friend of mine (in attempt to change my beliefs in evolution) brought up the subject of apes still inhabiting the earth and that it would not be so if we were decended from them. I wonder if anyone here has any theories on the subject.

[ughaibu]

There's an argument that great apes are more evolutionarily advanced than humans, so by your (friend's) view you should be wondering why we're still around.

[maikeru]

I wonder if theories of evolution are accurate and we are in fact decended from the apes, then why are they still around?

 

Your friend seems to think we're descended directly from the other great apes like gorillas and chimpanzees. This is a variation of the "we're descended from monkeys" argument that's often pinned on evolution. We're not. Evolution suggests that we have a common ancestor--that is, somewhere far back many millions of years ago, our ancestors (we modern humans not even existing, technically) shared a genetic lineage with them, but as different apes went their separate ways, faced new challenges, or entered new areas and new conditions, the species and populations have diverged and evolved. Humans and the genus Homo have a long lineage stretching back millions of years. We're another part of a bigger family that includes apes and we are apes, based on genetics, physiology, skeletal features, etc.

 

Here, maybe the Scientific American website might give some more info:

6. If humans descended from monkeys, why are there still monkeys?

 

This surprisingly common argument reflects several levels of ignorance about evolution. The first mistake is that evolution does not teach that humans descended from monkeys; it states that both have a common ancestor.

 

The deeper error is that this objection is tantamount to asking, "If children descended from adults, why are there still adults?" New species evolve by splintering off from established ones, when populations of organisms become isolated from the main branch of their family and acquire sufficient differences to remain forever distinct. The parent species may survive indefinitely thereafter, or it may become extinct.

 

From: 15 Answers to Creationist Nonsense: Scientific American

 

To me, this seems very similar to asking "Why are there different ethnicities and colors of people in the world?" (I won't use the term race because it's broad, generalized, and useless--genetic evidence suggests that the current conception of race is baseless. E.g., one study I read said that sub-Saharan Africa shows tremendous genetic diversity, enough to constitute 11-13 "races," although they would all be considered "black" by race. This clearly suggests that the concept of race is useless.) The genetic and anthropological evidence seem to suggest that we came from one place and gradually different groups of people splintered off of each other and diverged a bit over thousands to hundreds of years to have different hair, eye, and skin colors, to varying degrees. Not all groups or ethnicities of people are still here. Some have been conquered, intermixed, or been cruelly exterminated. But humans show incredible diversity, even though genetically we are so close. Think of the greater genetic diversity that lies between us and chimpanzees, where we're separated by a 1-2% difference. Or slightly greater differences between us and gorillas or orangutans. All these lineages have split off earlier or later and evolved on their own and split into further lineages. There are two main species of gorillas, but further differentiated into four subspecies. There are two species of chimpanzees, common and bonobo. Four subspecies of common and only one bonobo. The genetic lineages keep splintering until we come down to families and individuals.

 

Our genetic code is not perfect, its fidelity is not perfect, and every individual turns out a little bit different from one's predecessors and other fellow individuals. Change and error are inevitable as DNA makes mistakes when replicating itself. Families are more related to each other than most outsiders. Brothers and sisters more so to each other. And identical twins and clones are nearly perfect. That's the secret of life and evolution. Natural selection acts on the variation found in populations to create new lineages, and sometimes lineages are given the opportunity or chance to diverge and undergo further change, modification, and selection, and these selected modifications are retained. Forces of divergence and unification duel with each other. Neither are supreme, but both are necessary. Evolution is about survivors. This is evolution in a nutshell.

 

Image:Hominidae.PNG - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

Take special note of the left of the diagram.

 

From Wiki's human evolution article:

Molecular evidence further suggests that between 8 and 4 Mya, first the gorillas, and then the chimpanzee (genus Pan) split off from the line leading to the humans; human DNA is 98.4 percent identical to the DNA of chimpanzees. We have no fossil record, however, of either group of African great apes, possibly because bones do not fossilize in rain forest environments.

 

So, as I mentioned, we are not directly descended from the other great apes, because their own paths and genetic lineages split off 4 to 8 million years ago, and they continued to split, die off, and survive into today's gorilla and chimpanzee species and subspecies. Ours too. We have a long list of ancestors and near relatives.

 

Try reading these Wiki articles for more info:

 

Human evolution - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Hominidae - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Homo (genus) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

Other species of the genus Homo are not alive. Remember, extinction is always an option for other species, even former human species. But we've survived and prospered.

 

I have never questioned this point before, but a friend of mine (in attempt to change my beliefs in evolution) brought up the subject of apes still inhabiting the earth and that it would not be so if we were decended from them. I wonder if anyone here has any theories on the subject.

 

Ask your friend if he or she can explain evolution in a clear and concise manner. I'd be willing to wager probably not.

 

Evolution's a part of the same science that can explain why your car works, airplanes fly, and we can send people and satellites into outer space. If evolution truly has so little to stand on, fear for science itself! Don't drive a car, run for cover when an airplane is overhead, and put on your aluminum foil cap to block out the bad vibes from aliens trying to listen to your thoughts. Everyone's been lying to us the entire time. :)

[InfiniteNow]

That's the secret of life and evolution. Natural selection acts on the variation found in populations to create new lineages, and sometimes lineages are given the opportunity or chance to diverge and undergo further change, modification, and selection, and these selected modifications are retained. Forces of divergence and unification duel with each other. Neither are supreme, but both are necessary. Evolution is about survivors. This is evolution in a nutshell.

Not just this piece, but the whole thing. Nicely explained maikeru. :)

[Moontanman]

I wonder if theories of evolution are accurate and we are in fact decended from the apes, then why are they still around?

 

I have never questioned this point before, but a friend of mine (in attempt to change my beliefs in evolution) brought up the subject of apes still inhabiting the earth and that it would not be so if we were decended from them. I wonder if anyone here has any theories on the subject.

 

The best way I can answer that question is to say if I decended from my mother why is she still alive? Evolution is seldom a dorect line back into time. I am alive and so are my cousins. Yet we both share the same ancestors.