Animal Sacrifices and Religion

[HydrogenBond]

Although animals sacrifices had been a part of many early religions, this is no longer practiced by most main religions. When religion did sacrifice animals, it was often to appease the wrath of the gods or seek their favor. What is sort of interesting is that there is still an aspect of culture that uses the ancient practice of animals sacrifices. This is called medicine. These animal sacrifices are to appease uncertainty and wrath, as well as to seek favor. it was done for the best interests of the tribe. Does that parallel has a connection to ancient religion?

 

One way to look at it, ancient religion was also uncertain of cause and affect such that reality was subject to the whims of the gods. Some day the gods were in a good mood and other days in a bad mood. Chaos ruled the darkness of their ignorance. They didn't have the ability to reason to know the difference. There was a probability either could occur. So they would sacrifice animals just in case. Is there much difference between the two in terms of appeasing wrath and coaxing favor, for the best interest of the tribe, because knowledge is stuck in the darkness?

 

There is one main difference. The ancient animal sacrifices were relatively humane. It was done quickly. Now the sacrifice is more based on torture where the sacrifice can linger. Maybe the requirements of the gods have changed so this is the modern way. But still, it is done then and now to bring health and prosperity to the tribe.

 

Another possible difference is in the olden days the high priest, and maybe a few buddies would be in charge and do most of the sacrificing. Now the high priests have assigned the task to more of the subordinates. It is possible the volume require to appease uncertainty and wrath and seek favor of the gods has gotten beyond a small group of people. But it still follows the template of only sanctioned hands can do this.

[Moontanman]

What I think is interesting about animal sacrifice is that they were often burned. Religious texts often told of the smell of cooking meat being pleasing to the god.

[ughaibu]

Are you serious? http://hypography.com/forums/social-sciences/10462-animal-sacrifices-sep-church-state.html

[Boerseun]

There's no comparison.

 

Animals were sacrificed to the "gods" of old because humans didn't quite catch the relationship between cause and effect, in a big way. As humans started learning more of the natural world, animal sacrifices tapered off. And yes, they were killed quickly, because it's pretty lame to torture an animal for the hell of it - pardon the pun.

 

Modern "animal sacrifices" are not performed to appease any magical or mystical invisible superbeing. Modern "animal sacrifices", if you're talking animals dying in human laboratories, performing sample studies of chemicals that may or may not be deadly to humans, are dying in order for us humans to understand even more of the natural world.

 

There's no comparison - the one is deeply seated in irrationality and superstition, the other one is deeply seated in the polar opposite of that.

 

To Moontanman:

 

Genesis and Exodus tells in detail on how the roving and roaming priests were to be treated. Specific pieces (usually the best cuts) of any animal was reserved for the priest, "God" said so - the priest usually rocks up at the smell of a barbeque and takes his cut and is off again, performing no real service of any kind to the community apart from reigning over them with pure, unadulterated terror and fear. He takes his meat, mumbles a few syllables, and is off again.

 

Yes, priests have been social leeches for thousands of years. And their racket have been running for as long - the mafia's got nothing on them.

[Michaelangelica]

O dear straying into the theology threads I must be bored.

I only got this far

Although animals sacrifices had been a part of many early religions, this is no longer practiced by most main religions

We have ritualised animal sacrifices now.

Communion in the catholic church turns wine and bread in the the actual body and blood of the real Jesus Christ. That is Catholic theology, set in concrete( or stone?)> When you partake of communion you are eating flesh and blood not bread and wine.

 

By the way, real human flesh tastes like mild lamb.

 

All religions seem to have odd ideas, customs and practices about animals even Buddhism.

[HydrogenBond]

There's no comparison.

Animals were sacrificed to the "gods" of old because humans didn't quite catch the relationship between cause and effect, in a big way. As humans started learning more of the natural world, animal sacrifices tapered off. And yes, they were killed quickly, because it's pretty lame to torture an animal for the hell of it - pardon the pun.

 

In modern days the animals will often suffer a lingering death, which is not an upgrade in ritual behavior. Nowadays, the relationships between cause and affect are also lacking, which why you run "blind" testing. If we could take the blind fold off and understand cause and affect, this ancient ritual could also become obsolete.

 

The animals sacrifices when also done in good faith. They worked under the assumption that was needed and beneficial for the common good, based on their understanding of nature. It was not something done blindly, although it was done because they were blind to cause and affect. Empirical science and animals sacrifices still has one foot stuck in the dark ages. The science affect looks modern, due to superficial dressing with high tech tools, but it still has ties to the dark ages. It amounts to the farmer in the tuxedo; he looks like a modern socialite, but in reality inside he is down to earth.

 

After the main religions got rid of animals sacrifices it was still practiced in pockets by pagans, witches and satanic rituals. They kept this ancient tradition going. Today, the god of chaos is an extension of this underground tradition. The church tried to eliminate chaos and think in terms of order, but chaos took a foothold. There is still sort of a magic to this ritual when results randomly appear from chaos. That shows the offering was acceptable to the god chaos.

[Boerseun]

I think there's a very good chance that you've lost the plot there somewhere.

 

In the old days, animals were sacrificed to appease imaginary gods (real to its followers, at least in their minds). Animals are today not "sacrificed" to any imaginary beings, those that are "sacrificed" in the laboratories of science are killed with the express intent to increase our understanding of the natural world.

[ughaibu]

I guess nobody clicked my link.

Hey! Moderators! Why not merge this with Hydrogen Bond's previous thread on the same stuff.

[Turtle]

This thread seemed the best fit for this story. :naughty:

 

FOXNews.com - Pope Demands Ban on Crucified Frog Sculpture - International News | News of the World | Middle East News | Europe News

Surely this is not a work of art but a blashphemy and a disgusting piece of trash that upsets many people," Franz Pahl, president of the regional government who opposed the sculpture, read from a letter from the Vatican to Reuters.

 

The Vatican letter said that the work "wounds the religious sentiments of so many people who see in the cross the symbol of God's love."

 

Let's all work to make sure that the only grizzly brutal animal sacrifices we depict are of the human variety , eh?

[Michaelangelica]

This thread seemed the best fit for this story. :naughty:

 

FOXNews.com - Pope Demands Ban on Crucified Frog Sculpture - International News | News of the World | Middle East News | Europe News

 

 

Let's all work to make sure that the only grizzly brutal animal sacrifices we depict are of the human variety , eh?

 

Good idea for new tourist fodder, cane toad sculptures though:evil:

 

During the recent visit of the Pope to Oz a"pilgrim" was looking at a display of gold-cross-necklaces offered by a quick thinking, Chinese entrepreneur.

 

She seemed reluctant to buy at his temptation table in front of the shop.

The Chinese sales guy,seeing a sale slipping away, said:-

"You come inside; I have some with little man on them!"

 

Then that reminds me of my irreligious kids on a school trip to Japan at Christmas time being shocked, horrified and stunned at the display in a big Japanese department store- Santa nailed to a cross !!

The Japanese obviously don't 'get' it!!

 

PS Oz and Australia

I usually use 'Oz' when I am talking about the fabled, land of dumb lotus eaters

"Australia" when I am more serious.

[HydrogenBond]

I was just playfully drawing a parallel. The ancients sacrificed animals to appease gods, because the world was not rational or in touch with cause and affect. In their world anything could happen, so they needed the blessing of the gods to make the dice roll their way. They had their own version of chaos theory.

 

Modern medicine still uses an empirical approach since one can not rationally predict this inner body reality. It is not trees and rocks moving around, but it is sort of the same thing in terms of those magical germs. We don't really know what will happen if we place this medicine in the magical landscape of the body. The gods could be angry or happy. To make sure we will sacrifice animals to appease the gods of chaos who at any time can change their mind. They often do. One group of animal sacrifices may bring a new product to market allowing the tribe to prosper. A year later the gods are fickle and they change their mind and the sacrifice is no longer pleasing.

 

With religion, once nature was seen as predictable and had a rational basis they no longer needed animal sacrifices. This was a waste of animals since the affect was only ceremonial. Once medicine reaches a rational basis then the same affects will be predictable and maybe animal sacrifices will only become ceremonial tradition, for old times sake.

 

What people forget is when animal sacrifices were used in religion they continued because people saw a positive correlation. It appeared to work and appease the fear of the unknown. They didn't do it because they thought it didn't work or wasn't necessary.

[Turtle]

I was just playfully drawing a parallel.

 

So was I. The Christians celebrate/re-enact animal sacrifice to this day when they take communion. "This is my blood...drink up;this is my body, chow down." Not only sacrifice, but canabalism. :) Who needs medicine when ya got that in your corner? :doh:

[HydrogenBond]

Bread and wine are not animal products both are products of plants. Do a chemical analysis to prove it to yourself. But medicine is still retro using actual animals to appease the gods of chaos. Maybe we need to sacrifice the god Chaos so we can save animals. Then researcher can have bread and wine and make medicines.

 

I often wonder what the god Chaos looks like. Does he/ she not have a picture because it changes? That would be a scary god and maybe I can see the need to remain retro.

[Michaelangelica]

Its all very odd really.

 

I guess modern sensibilities would not take to a priest digging around the warm entrails of a chook (chicken) or cow to see what the gods were up to.

 

Is there any other animal on the planet other than man that does this?

 

It used to be thought that the events that changed the world were things like big bombs, maniac politicians, huge earthquakes, or vast population movements, but it has now been realized that this is a very old-fashioned view held by people totally out of touch with modern thought. The things that really change the world, according to Chaos theory, are the tiny things. A butterfly flaps its wings in the Amazonian jungle, and subsequently a storm ravages half of Europe.

Somewhere in Adam's sleeping head, a butterfly had emerged.

TP NG GOOD OMENS

 

Most chaos mathematicians work in the stock market

[charles brough]

In Indonesia, the largest Muslim nation, once a year there is a religious day in which animals such as goats and chickens that have been tethered next to the street curb for a day or so are butchered by average citizen volunteers. The meat is then distributed to the poor. My driver volunteered one day to do that and said he was covered with blood. He was proud to do it.

 

On the Temple Mount in Jeruselem, orthodox believers of Judaism intend someday to tear down the mosques there and rebuild their Temple. They have been forced to get by with only synagogues since their Temple was torn down by the Romans in 70 AD. They already have all the implements they need, once the Temple is rebuilt, to then proceed to slaughter animals such as cows inside the Temple according to the laws and procedures outlined in their Scriptures.

 

I did not notice any posts to the affect that animal sacrifice was a humanistic innovation following the human-sacrifice age. Now, we have our humanistic innovation away from any sacrifice. This one of the ways we have made good progress!

 

In the previous posts, I noticed many references to ancient people as not following cause and effect and knowing logic. I propose that this is self-serving. All throughout human history, people have always sought cause and effect. They have always thought as logically considering what little they knew. "Spirits" were then the most logical explanation of things. It was a successful cause and effect way of explaining the world to them. It was no where near as accurate as our modern way of natural cause and effect, but then, someday, we will do a lot better than we do now, also! We do have myths in both science and our secular beliefs. Progress is not just in electronic gadgets and drugs but as well in how people think.