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Atheists Vs. Athists


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#1 Ludwik

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Posted 06 June 2012 - 07:30 PM

My theist-atheist article appeared in the April 2012 Issue of
American Atheist Magazine. The link is:

atheist

Comments will be appreciated.

Ludwik Kowalski (see Wikipedia)


#2 Turtle

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Posted 06 June 2012 - 11:40 PM

as your essay seems to recommend keeping "spirtualism" and science apart, your posting a thread on it at our science site strikes me as contrary to that position. you're just adding fuel to the fire and that is unwelcome and ill advised as we have entirely too much of this crap here already.

#3 SextonBlake

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 01:03 PM

I have debated with theists for over a decade and no matter what proofs, evidence or facts you show them, you are wasting your time because an irrational belief cannot be cured by rationality.

If they would mind their own business and keep their religion to their bedrooms as the article says, I would happily let them babble to empty air 24/365 but they will not. Christianity, islam and such have very bloody histories and must not be allowed to rule the West again. If some bearded know nothing freak in a muslim country wants to go ga-ga, that is up to him but when he calls for the death of western people then he should be assassinated by any means possible. Such people need to know where we stand which also includes muslim-butt kissing politicians.

I think people debate with the loonies because if we do not, they will know they are right rather than just believing they are right.

#4 Ludwik

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 01:47 AM

I have debated with theists for over a decade and no matter what proofs, evidence or facts you show them, you are wasting your time because an irrational belief cannot be cured by rationality.

If they would mind their own business and keep their religion to their bedrooms as the article says, I would happily let them babble to empty air 24/365 but they will not. Christianity, islam and such have very bloody histories and must not be allowed to rule the West again. If some bearded know nothing freak in a muslim country wants to go ga-ga, that is up to him but when he calls for the death of western people then he should be assassinated by any means possible. Such people need to know where we stand which also includes muslim-butt kissing politicians.

I think people debate with the loonies because if we do not, they will know they are right rather than just believing they are right.


Why am I for separation? Because most of us (scientists) are not qualified to discuss with theologians, and vice versa. That is why debates should be between scientists who are also theologians, and vice versa. .

L.K.

Edited by Ludwik, 10 June 2012 - 01:48 AM.


#5 Vexer

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 07:26 AM

>> If some bearded know nothing freak in a muslim country wants to go ga-ga, that is up to him but when he calls for the death of western people<<


That's literally never happened.

What *has* happened is that a bearded Muslim has voiced the concerns of most of the non-rich Arabs.

#6 C1ay

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 04:10 PM

>> If some bearded know nothing freak in a muslim country wants to go ga-ga, that is up to him but when he calls for the death of western people<<


That's literally never happened.

What *has* happened is that a bearded Muslim has voiced the concerns of most of the non-rich Arabs.

Wow, that's happened countless times and you claim it's never happened. Do you not read or watch any news? Western people are the most popular to get the blame for the ills in poor Muslim nations. It is commonplace for them to call for the destruction of the west.

#7 CraigD

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Posted 11 June 2012 - 12:00 AM

If some bearded know nothing freak in a muslim country wants to go ga-ga, that is up to him but when he calls for the death of western people then he should be assassinated by any means possible.

That's literally never happened.

Wow, that's happened countless times and you claim it's never happened.

Whether a Muslim has called for the killing of a citizen of a western
In a strict, factual sense, Sexton and C1ay are correct, and Vexer is wrong.

All that’s needed to refute the claim that a Muslim calling for the death of a westerner “has never happened” is a single counter example. Arguable the most famous recent such example is 14 Feb 1989 radio broadcast of a speech believed with high confidence to have been dictated by Ruhollah Khomeini’s, an Iranian Islamic authority, call for the killing of Salman Rushdie, a British writer. Translated to English, his speech included:


"I would like to inform all the intrepid Muslims in the world that the author of the book entitled 'Satanic Verses'. . . as well as those publishers who were aware of its contents, are hereby sentenced to death. I call on all zealous Moslems to execute them quickly, wherever they find them, so that no one will dare to insult Islamic sanctity. Whoever is killed doing this will be regarded as a martyr and will go directly to heaven."

(source: 2011 About.com article Ayatollah Khomeini's 1989 Fatwa on Salman Rushdie Over "The Satanic Verses")

However, regardless of ones opinion of his moral virtue (personally, I think that people who advocate killing are morally poor) I think referring to Kohmeini, a religious scholar and powerful politician who rose to the position of greatest political power and religious authority in Iran as “a bearded freak”, ridiculously mischaracterizes him. He, and other religious and secular authorities, are not freakish anomalies, but, in a very real sense, epitomes of their societies.

#8 Vexer

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Posted 13 June 2012 - 05:37 AM

Craig, " for the death of western people" I read that to mean *all* Western people.

As in "Western People".

#9 LJP07

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Posted 09 July 2012 - 10:20 AM

I have debated with theists for over a decade and no matter what proofs, evidence or facts you show them, you are wasting your time because an irrational belief cannot be cured by rationality.


I think you're missing the point though - the whole idea is that believing in god is beyond human comprehension and thus rationality. Arguing to a theist with reason and trying to win would be like being trained in martial arts to beat a vulture in the sky that you could never possibly get to.

Edited by LJP07, 09 July 2012 - 10:20 AM.