inside the sun Posted February 20, 2006 Report Share Posted February 20, 2006 The beatles seam to be more than just music, musicans, i don't know why, but i would go so far as to say they are the voice of reason.Is god, the sun or water. both create and destroy life, both are very powerfu beings, yet, hmm is either one of them independent, what is the sun dependent on? It seams everything is dependent on something, and therefore independence is a myth, is there anything that is independent, i think that would be god if anything were to be god? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ughaibu Posted February 20, 2006 Report Share Posted February 20, 2006 I guess you've heard of acid-fascism, Manson and The Beetles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inside the sun Posted February 20, 2006 Author Report Share Posted February 20, 2006 manson abused the power over human beings, but like all genius's i guess we should respect those who are smart even if they do things we disagree with, such as hitler, and manson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBigDog Posted February 20, 2006 Report Share Posted February 20, 2006 I am a huge Beatles fan. "Abbey Road" is the greatest album ever made. There are intricacies to the Beatles that will be emerging into our consciousness for generations. That being said, I think that John Lennon in the end was hypocritical and insidiously evil. Ok, let me have it. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CraigD Posted February 20, 2006 Report Share Posted February 20, 2006 That being said, I think that John Lennon in the end was hypocritical and insidiously evil.Toward the end of his life, Lennon wrote a few songs I would rather he’d not (“Woman” is one I’d be happy to unhear, if such was possible), but “insidiously evil?”:lol: You’ll have to explain yourself on this one, BigDog. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turtle Posted February 20, 2006 Report Share Posted February 20, 2006 Toward the end of his life, Lennon wrote a few songs I would rather he’d not . ___I don't know when Lennon wrote 'Happiness is a warm gun', but it's rather ironic. I'd rather I hadn't heard it as it pops into my head every time I get strapped. Then we have Yoco at the Olympics reading from John's 'Imagine'...imagine all the people...no religion too...:lol: If any evil crept into John's later life, it may have come in in the folds of Yoco's robe.:D :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inside the sun Posted February 21, 2006 Author Report Share Posted February 21, 2006 ooooooooo yoco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gabe Bixler Posted February 21, 2006 Report Share Posted February 21, 2006 john lennon was a very angry man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inside the sun Posted February 21, 2006 Author Report Share Posted February 21, 2006 i guess we can continue to look at his downside and exploit them.He wasn't perfect, nor was any man that walked this earth, includding buddha and jesus christ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfiniteNow Posted February 21, 2006 Report Share Posted February 21, 2006 I am a huge Beatles fan. "Abbey Road" is the greatest album ever made. Oh... come on... What about "Rubber Soul?" "Revolver?" I don't care who says it, or what their belief system, but I, myself, thourough am hopeful it when I... Imagine there’s no heaven,It’s easy if you try,No hell below us,Above us only sky,Imagine all the peopleLiving for today... Imagine there’s no countries,It isn’t hard to do,Nothing to kill or die for,No religion too,Imagine all the peopleLiving life in peace... Imagine no possessions,I wonder if you can,No need for greed or hunger,A brotherhood of man,Imagine all the peopleSharing all the world... You may say I’m a dreamer,But I’m not the only one,I hope some day you’ll join us,And the world will live as one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inside the sun Posted February 22, 2006 Author Report Share Posted February 22, 2006 You may say I’m a dreamer,But I’m not the only one,I hope some day you’ll join us,And the world will live as one.:-* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBigDog Posted February 22, 2006 Report Share Posted February 22, 2006 Toward the end of his life, Lennon wrote a few songs I would rather he’d not (“Woman” is one I’d be happy to unhear, if such was possible), but “insidiously evil?”:) You’ll have to explain yourself on this one, BigDog.And explain I will. I hate communism. It is the gravest danger to mankind. It suppresses that which makes mankind achieve greatness - the human desire for personal achievement. Communism preaches that the self is meaningless, and that the collective society is everything. And that everything should be done for society first, and for yourself second. But altruism is not its own reward, and you cannot suppress people need to being unique, or self expression, or being valued. Those are all the things that communism does. The song "Imagine" is the very heart of my problem with John Lennon. It is a beautiful song, and paints a utopia that people like to hold up as ideal. It is insidiously evil because people do not think about what the ramifications of such a society, and in turn they are poisoning the efforts toward real improvement when they hold as ideal such a white elephant society, and let it influence how they drive our current world. Imagine there’s no heaven,It’s easy if you try,No hell below us,Above us only sky,Imagine all the peopleLiving for today...The first four lines are just trying to get people to put religion out of their heads. A central tenet of communism, and I will be getting back to this point. Imagine all the people living for today. What would the ramifications of this action really be? If nobody gave a thought to tomorrow. Think you have a population problem now? Let go of foresight and impulse control and see where it leads. Nice thought from a distance, but a failure in practice. How about feeding people, and getting from point A to point B. Or all of the invisible services that we take for granted. Or the miracles of medicine that prevent suffering and allow the sick to be well and thrive. All the result of living in the moment? Imagine there’s no countries,It isn’t hard to do,Nothing to kill or die for,No religion too,Imagine all the peopleLiving life in peace...Now we have the removal of cultural identity. The removal of pride for being part of a place that is unique to other places. Of society being comprised of smaller societies with borders and laws so that people of differing philosophies can have a place to be among kin, and travel to enjoy the cultures of others. Nothing to kill or die for. There are things to kill or die for in this world. The pacifist people of this earth live at the mercy of the hawks. Human nature will always generate people who do not want to play by the rules, especially when there is no consequence to breaking said rules. Tibet will be free any day now, right? No religion too. This goes back to taking away from people the right to freedom of belief. I am free to do anything, except to believe in religion. That sounds like freedom to me! Imagine all the people living life in Peace. The only lines of the song that I don't have a problem with and the only ones I choose to imagine. Imagine no possessions,I wonder if you can,No need for greed or hunger,A brotherhood of man,Imagine all the peopleSharing all the world...Imagine no possessions? Lets play this one out to the end. Where do I live? What do I eat? How do I travel? What do I do? This goes back to the communism, and making everyone a ward of the state. You don't need to possess anything, because anything you need is given to you freely. Oh, but you have to do your part in making things available to everyone else. And you cannot want what you do not need. So Just accept what you get. After all, it is the society that is important, not you. I cannot imagine no possessions, except in a picture of society throwing back to the stone age and man begin reduced to scavenging and hiding from predators. No need for greed or hunger? Exactly where is all the food coming from if nobody is living except for today? Oh, and all the people sharing all the world. But only if you don't want what you don't need. Only if nobody desires anything except for the brotherhood of man above all else, especially personal human comforts or ambitions. Again, the very height of freedom. You may say I’m a dreamer,But I’m not the only one,I hope some day you’ll join us,And the world will live as one.Yes John, you are a dreamer. And you are not alone. However, I will never join you, I will instead spend my life insuring that dreamers like you have a comfortable place to preach nonsense from while you spit at me for keeping you down. The world is not one. It is 6.5 billion. Wishing cannot and will not change that. The utopia described in this song would remove every hope of every individual from ever being realized. The suffering and madness that would be required are unconscionable. The power void that would remain, and the central controlled supply network would make slaves of everyone in the name of freedom. This is not an ideal society. It is poison. It should be recognized as such. And it should be discouraged. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfiniteNow Posted February 22, 2006 Report Share Posted February 22, 2006 Wow... we struck a nerve there, eh, BigDog? :) What if we lived more like the ants do? What would be the human society's analog to a community of ants... complete with all their efficiency and proven survival methods? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBigDog Posted February 22, 2006 Report Share Posted February 22, 2006 Wow... we struck a nerve there, eh, BigDog? :)I feel much better now... :) What if we lived more like the ants do? What would be the human society's analog to a community of ants... complete with all their efficiency and proven survival methods?Where is the freedom for the indivitual ant? Do you want to be a cog on a great wheel with no say in your daily life? Does an ant have a mind of its own that appreciates that there may be more to the world than following a trail of piss? Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turtle Posted February 22, 2006 Report Share Posted February 22, 2006 I feel much better now... :) Where is the freedom for the indivitual ant? Do you want to be a cog on a great wheel with no say in your daily life? Does an ant have a mind of its own that appreciates that there may be more to the world than following a trail of piss? Bill ___When the big dog feels better, the house sleeps peacfully.:) No individual ant freedom.No I don't want to be just a cog.No the ant has no mind of its own.___I heard a radio news report yesterday saying that back when the Beatles left India & the Yogi, they said it was because the Yogi was hitting on Mia Farrow; now the story is out that the Yogi sent them away because he didn't like them using drugs over there.___John is just another example of a performer believing he is as great as his fans say he is.:) Good grief! :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ughaibu Posted February 22, 2006 Report Share Posted February 22, 2006 According to Wragg Morley in The Ant World, there are "lazy ants", I dont remember if he describes other traits of individualism in ants but he at least contends that laziness is one. Turtle 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfiniteNow Posted February 22, 2006 Report Share Posted February 22, 2006 Do you want to be a cog on a great wheel with no say in your daily life? Isn't it possible that this is already the case? I have no conclusive evidence either way... Does an ant have a mind of its own that appreciates that there may be more to the world than following a trail of piss?Again, I have no conclusive evidence either way, but come to think of it, I no evidence that we do anything differently either... I'm not trying to make a big stink and make some absolute comment about us being ants or ants being free thinkers... just that the examples one can provide either way do not satisfactorily resolve the issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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