The Soul

[Flummoxed]

I like the 'smoke and mirrors' description! But if you're familliar with the James Randi $1,000,000 challenge then that would about cover it.

I wasnt but I am now https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_Million_Dollar_Paranormal_Challenge

 

I wonder if I could take him to an alleged haunted house with atmosphere and wire it for sound, would he buy it, or cough the cash. The challenge was terminated in 2015 so I guess not

[montgomery]

I wasnt but I am now https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_Million_Dollar_Paranormal_Challenge

 

I wonder if I could take him to an alleged haunted house with atmosphere and wire it for sound, would he buy it, or cough the cash. The challenge was terminated in 2015 so I guess not

I think he's already done a haunted house challenge. 

[Dubbelosix]

If it means anything coming from me, I do believe there is more than what the conscious mind can detect. I am not saying ghosts are real, but a perception of something beyond would mean ''ghosts'' are a metaphor for something many people have experienced.

[MikeBrace]

I've spent a lifetime thinking about 'the Soul'. Most people have a perception of what a 'soul' is, but I think few have actually defined it. I submit this for your review:

 

The spark of life in you, your life force, is just your consciousness (you) collaborating with organic cells (also made up of matter and energy) on a very large scale in order to survive in a place where everything eats everything else just to stay alive. It’s who you see when you look in the mirror. Most, if not all living organisms [that do not belong to a collective] have a life force. We humans call it our consciousness.

 

A soul is a mental and spiritual entity that influences a life force (your consciousness) to act in a sustaining and nurturing manner. Depending on how closely your consciousness listens to it the soul is capable of controlling the life force of a living organism beyond its basic instincts (and what Mother Nature intended for it), and the soul is the only life force capable of understanding and offering an act of compassion on its own free will.

 

 

 

A soul [by definition] acts as a compassionate being on its own free will. As such, it can only occupy a living creature that has a conscious, one that can be controlled and one that is capable of showing an act of compassion. However it is not as powerful as your life force (your consciousness) and if your consciousness so chooses to it can override your soul’s emotions, especially involving acts of compassion.

 

Compassion? The Merriam-Webster Dictionary [loaded in this computer’s word program] defines compassion as:

• Sympathetic consciousness of others' distress together with a desire to alleviate it
• A feeling of wanting to help someone who is sick, hungry, in trouble, etc.

This dictionary goes on to list some of the more common synonyms as:

• commiseration, sympathy, feeling

I find it rather odd that this dictionary (as well as most others that I looked at) missed the boat completely on defining the word compassion. They all seem to define compassion as an adjective and liken it to a level of sympathy (or empathy) for another person. It has to be more than that. If not, where does that leave an ‘act of compassion’ when compared to an ‘act of empathy’ or an ‘act of sympathy’?

 

Think about it. An act of compassion is more than just describing a feeling of sympathy towards someone’s plight; it’s actually doing something to help them alleviate their pains and sorrows. It is the physical act of ‘lending a helping hand’.

 

Here’s what I propose we consider as the more complete definition of Compassion as it pertains to the soul:

 

Compassion (noun):

The investment and/or expenditure of a personal asset on behalf of another living being, knowing that there exists a high probability that there will be an immediate negative rate of return on the investment, but cognizant of the fact that the recipient(s) of this expenditure may benefit in a positive manner from this expenditure.

 

Act of compassion (verb):

Showing or exhibiting compassion.

 

Here is a simplified version of compassion:

Willingly helping another living creature by freely giving away your time, physical help and/or wealth knowing that in all likelihood this creature cannot immediately pay you back, and that in many cases (and in all likelihood) you risk losing more than just your initial investment, but that [if you have judged the situation wisely] the recipient of your giving’s will use your giving’s wisely for the betterment of themselves, others and/or this planet.

 

I submit that 'Compassion' defines the soul and is unique to the soul.

[fahrquad]

The human mind cannot accept the fact that life is finite and created the concept of a "soul" that transcends the end of physical existence.  Try as it might, science has never been able to prove or disprove the existence of a soul any more than it has proven or disproven the existence of a supreme deity.  As I may have mentioned previously, I died twice a few years ago and I remember nothing except slipping into inky black silence until being rudely jolted back to life.

[Flummoxed]

The human mind cannot accept the fact that life is finite and created the concept of a "soul" that transcends the end of physical existence.  Try as it might, science has never been able to prove or disprove the existence of a soul any more than it has proven or disproven the existence of a supreme deity.  As I may have mentioned previously, I died twice a few years ago and I remember nothing except slipping into inky black silence until being rudely jolted back to life.

 

Inky Black silence is something to remember :) 

 

The concept of soul is generally religion based. This link covers most of the views on this thread https://www.britannica.com/topic/soul-religion-and-philosophy

 

Notably the Pantheist/Hippy/sexed up atheist view is not included. The Universe is god and every thing in it is part of said god which is an automaton.

 

Its all just smoke and mirrors. 

[MikeBrace]

The human mind cannot accept the fact that life is finite and created the concept of a "soul" that transcends the end of physical existence.  Try as it might, science has never been able to prove or disprove the existence of a soul any more than it has proven or disproven the existence of a supreme deity.  As I may have mentioned previously, I died twice a few years ago and I remember nothing except slipping into inky black silence until being rudely jolted back to life.

 

I think that most 'human minds' have accepted the fact that life is finite, so I'm not buying your concept that we created a 'soul' to transcend the end of our physical existence. Even you yourself 'died' twice [and yet] your consciousness did not. Even if you slipped into 'an inky black silence' it was [still] a state of existence that you recognized as a physical state of existence and could describe. And your conscious returned twice, so 'something' about you continued to exist after your body was not capable of harboring it. And when it was [again]. it came back.

 

I will 'agree' in part with you that religion tried to define the soul to its own benefit, but that has gotten it nowhere; especially when it tried to define its existence as 'eternal'. But that's not the definition of a soul in the first place. What most people consider to be the 'soul' is really just your consciousness.

 

The spark of life in you, your life force, is just your consciousness (you) collaborating with organic cells (also made up of matter and energy) on a very large scale in order to survive in a place where everything eats everything else just to stay alive. It’s who you see when you look in the mirror. Most, if not all living organisms [that do not belong to a collective] have a life force. We humans call it our consciousness. But that is not a soul.

 

Think of your consciousness as an elephant. It does what it does to stay alive, experience pleasure and avoid pain/death. Think of your soul (if you have one...and not everybody has one) as the rider on that elephant. For the most part it controls the elephant in an attempt to do its bidding. And as I stated above, for the most part the only thing your soul wants to do is treat others as it wishes to be treated itself. And so it steers the elephant accordingly. It cannot physically force the elephant to go where it wants it to, or do as it wishes it to; it can only try to influence it. And, as I said early, the soul's unique trait is that of compassion. It will always try to make the elephant make a compassionate decision when so confronted. Whether or not your consciousness listens to it is up to the owner of the soul.

[Flummoxed]

The human mind cannot accept the fact that life is finite and created the concept of a "soul" that transcends the end of physical existence.  Try as it might, science has never been able to prove or disprove the existence of a soul any more than it has proven or disproven the existence of a supreme deity.  As I may have mentioned previously, I died twice a few years ago and I remember nothing except slipping into inky black silence until being rudely jolted back to life.

 

Sounds like you were almost one with the universe 

[Flummoxed]

 

 

Think of your consciousness as an elephant. It does what it does to stay alive, experience pleasure and avoid pain/death. Think of your soul (if you have one...and not everybody has one) as the rider on that elephant. For the most part it controls the elephant in an attempt to do its bidding. And as I stated above, for the most part the only thing your soul wants to do is treat others as it wishes to be treated itself. And so it steers the elephant accordingly. It cannot physically force the elephant to go where it wants it to, or do as it wishes it to; it can only try to influence it. And, as I said early, the soul's unique trait is that of compassion. It will always try to make the elephant make a compassionate decision when so confronted. Whether or not your consciousness listens to it is up to the owner of the soul.

 

Some people have different morals/restraints in their make up, when partially drunk. A person who is normally considerate, can change and become uncaring, only to regret it the next day. 

 

During the period of intoxication, does the elephant lose its soul. Marula fruit often intoxicates elephants and other such creatures when it becomes ripe and falls of the trees. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZMvnccnDNw

 

Peace might be what is left when you are dead. Meditation and emptying ones mind as fahrquad did until he got a shock, becoming one with the universe :) . 

[Vmedvil2]

There are no Supreme Deities, There are no souls, this all religious nonsense. People wish for the universe to be a caring place, but it reality there is nothing that suggests that this universe favors good deeds over bad ones that is all in the eye of humanity that decides such things. If there was actually a supreme deity that favored good deeds over bad ones you would think not so many bad ones would happen, this makes me suggest that a soul is a fiction too. Without a supreme deity that cares about souls there is no soul either, it stands to reason there are mental constructs of electrical energy that is stored within neurons but the pattern to such a system disappears as soon as the neurons stop firing, if the neurons undergo necrosis that pattern vanishes forever unless the data of such a pattern in stored in another media, so in that sense a soul does exist but in the way that religious writings suggest it does is utter nonsense. To the point of this, if a supreme deity does exist he is just a alien with more advanced technology but the religious will argue up and down that "God" is not a alien, but does this make him a "Supreme being", No because he is just a more technologically advanced or evolved alien creature. For Instance, if I took a Jet Airplane or Laser Pointer back to the Roman Era they would think I was "God" or At-least a "Sorcerer". So, how is making a copy of someone's Neuron Patterns any different than being "God" which happens on a daily basis in the modern era, there is no soul just a advanced technology at work, these things that were saw as "acts of God" in previous time periods are things that happen on a daily basis in the modern era without even a consideration that "God" may be responsible and this species will get even more advanced than this over how ever long it is we survive to feats of even surpassing what our ancestors thought was "God-like". Jesus May have healed the Blind, but so has science, why would you put any stock into what ancient people's thought about this universe?, Throw away your belief in "False Gods" and start to believe in yourself and humanity, This goes along with the "Soul" stop believing in "false magic" and believe in technology and advancement.

Edited August 2, 2019 by VictorMedvil

[fahrquad]

...Peace might be what is left when you are dead. Meditation and emptying ones mind as fahrquad did until he got a shock, becoming one with the universe :) . 

 

My mind is empty most of the time as many here can attest.

[Flummoxed]

There are no Supreme Deities, There are no souls, this all religious nonsense. 

 

I guess that depends on your definition of supreme deities. The universe exists, pantheism stipulates the universe and everything in it is part of said deity. Under this none religious definition there is no separation of soul from god. Separate soul from god(the universe) is something that religions require to control people(numb nuts), and scare the crap out of them and send declared baddies to eternal hell, or one hell of a party. Depending on if your a sadist or masachist etc

 

Religous nonsense can be amusing when the Jehovas knock at the door :)  

 

 

My mind is empty most of the time as many here can attest.

 

I would not argue with your personal observations :) but under some religions forgetting the self and emptying the mind is a way to enlightenment (wtf enlightenment is I have no idea) Empty mind no stress everything calm not thinking maybe. If they went diving and tried narcosis at 40m on normal air mix, this can be achieved easily without a life time trying it. The Buddha clearly never scuba dived deep.

[MikeBrace]

There are no Supreme Deities, There are no souls, this all religious nonsense.

 

It is important that you separate the religion from the definition. Your physical consciousness is the basic operating system that controls the living entity in order to meet its basic survival needs. That is your 'elephant'. It has nothing to do with religion.

 

Not all living entities require a consciousness (an 'elephant') to properly operate themselves, but most higher, more evolved forms of life do have them. I think that most autonomous forms of life need one in order to survive. However, history has shown us countless number of examples there the physical consciousness can be influenced and modified beyond its basic needs; that is done by a spiritual consciousness; as soul. If you have such a consciousness present, that is your soul.

 

While religion has laid claim to this spiritual consciousness, it is a fallacy to think it defines it. Religion is a crutch developed by man to understand what they cannot comprehend. I maintain the spiritual consciousness (the soul) has nothing to do with religion, just as religion has nothing to do with reality.

 

The spiritual consciousness that controls your physical consciousness is what you know as a soul. A soul is an advanced operating system independent from your physical consciousness. You don't need a soul to survive, and [contrary to most forms of organized religion] not everyone has one.

 

If your religion dictates otherwise I’ll leave that discussion between you and to whomever you pray; this discussion only talks of the soul, not of religion.

[Flummoxed]

It is important that you separate the religion from the definition. Your physical consciousness is the basic operating system that controls the living entity in order to meet its basic survival needs. That is your 'elephant'. It has nothing to do with religion.

 

Not all living entities require a consciousness (an 'elephant') to properly operate themselves, but most higher, more evolved forms of life do have them. I think that most autonomous forms of life need one in order to survive. However, history has shown us countless number of examples there the physical consciousness can be influenced and modified beyond its basic needs; that is done by a spiritual consciousness; as soul. If you have such a consciousness present, that is your soul.

 

While religion has laid claim to this spiritual consciousness, it is a fallacy to think it defines it. Religion is a crutch developed by man to understand what they cannot comprehend. I maintain the spiritual consciousness (the soul) has nothing to do with religion, just as religion has nothing to do with reality.

 

The spiritual consciousness that controls your physical consciousness is what you know as a soul. A soul is an advanced operating system independent from your physical consciousness. You don't need a soul to survive, and [contrary to most forms of organized religion] not everyone has one.

 

If your religion dictates otherwise I’ll leave that discussion between you and to whomever you pray; this discussion only talks of the soul, not of religion.

 

The purpose of religion is to control society. It allows fanatics/idiots/retards to claim they understand what they don't, and justify their beliefs.  

 

I don't have a religion.

 

Can a rock an insect an elephant, a individual, Coco the clown have a soul. Please define further what you think your soul is that others who don't believe might not have :) Is your soul and god one and the same, as in Pantheism or are they separate entities. Do you have a separate soul to an ant, or are they the same connected in some weird entangled way. 

[MikeBrace]

It’s important that you understand word for word how I defined compassion for it is at the heart the definition of a 'soul'. Compassion defines the soul and is unique to the soul.

 

Compassion is not the same as 'sympathy' or 'empathy'. Those are just emotions. Compassion requires a physical act. Remember how I said the soul controls the consciousness?

 

 

Here is a good definition of compassion:

 

Compassion (noun):

 

The investment and/or expenditure of a personal asset on behalf of another living being, knowing that there exists a high probability that there will be an immediate negative rate of return on the investment, but cognizant of the fact that the recipient(s) of this expenditure may benefit in a positive manner from this expenditure.

 

 

 

 

Act of compassion (verb):

 

Showing or exhibiting compassion.

 

As far as who (or what) can have a soul, it's simple: it is a living creature with a conscious that can willingly and physically helping another living creature by freely giving away it's time, physical help and/or wealth knowing that in all likelihood this recipient of this act cannot immediately pay it back, and that in many cases (and in all likelihood) this creature risks losing more than just it's initial investment. However, the act of compassion is often used in the hope that the recipient will use your giving’s wisely for the betterment of themselves, others and/or this planet.

 

Back to your question; what can own a soul.

 

The single largest determining factor whether or not any physical being (with a conscious) would/could be occupied with a soul is if a physical entity has the ability to make a compassionate act on behalf of another physical entity. If that’s the case then it can in all likelihood be occupied by a soul. I have now come to understand why a living organism may or may not ever harbor a soul, but also why not all of them would ever harbor a soul in the first place. And while a dog would definitely qualify for ‘owning’ one, a lizard or chicken probably wouldn’t.

 

 

[Vmedvil2]

It’s important that you understand word for word how I defined compassion for it is at the heart the definition of a 'soul'. Compassion defines the soul and is unique to the soul.

 

Compassion is not the same as 'sympathy' or 'empathy'. Those are just emotions. Compassion requires a physical act. Remember how I said the soul controls the consciousness?

 

 

Here is a good definition of compassion:

 

Compassion (noun):

 

The investment and/or expenditure of a personal asset on behalf of another living being, knowing that there exists a high probability that there will be an immediate negative rate of return on the investment, but cognizant of the fact that the recipient(s) of this expenditure may benefit in a positive manner from this expenditure.

 

 

 

 

Act of compassion (verb):

 

Showing or exhibiting compassion.

 

As far as who (or what) can have a soul, it's simple: it is a living creature with a conscious that can willingly and physically helping another living creature by freely giving away it's time, physical help and/or wealth knowing that in all likelihood this recipient of this act cannot immediately pay it back, and that in many cases (and in all likelihood) this creature risks losing more than just it's initial investment. However, the act of compassion is often used in the hope that the recipient will use your giving’s wisely for the betterment of themselves, others and/or this planet.

 

Back to your question; what can own a soul.

 

The single largest determining factor whether or not any physical being (with a conscious) would/could be occupied with a soul is if a physical entity has the ability to make a compassionate act on behalf of another physical entity. If that’s the case then it can in all likelihood be occupied by a soul. I have now come to understand why a living organism may or may not ever harbor a soul, but also why not all of them would ever harbor a soul in the first place. And while a dog would definitely qualify for ‘owning’ one, a lizard or chicken probably wouldn’t.

 

 

 

This is a silly definition whether not you can do compassionate acts is having a soul that is metaphysical nonsense, which is even dumber than what the religious believe a soul is.

Edited August 6, 2019 by VictorMedvil

[MikeBrace]

This is a silly definition whether not you can do compassionate acts is having a soul that is metaphysical nonsense, which is even dumber than what the religious believe a soul is.

 

Then I take it you believe no one has a soul?