Major Ufo Sighting Causing Big News!

[Aethelwulf]

In my opinion and of Nick Pope, the kite explanation does not answer this Turtle. A remote controlled device is more likely I have said, but it raises more questions than it answers.

[Aethelwulf]

Of course, in the end of the day I can believe in more exotic answers such as visitors from another planet. I have after all first hand experience of a strange aerial phenomenon in which no conventional explanation fits. I'll sit happy believing this.

 

 

There are also many cases known today which far defy normal conventional explanations... events such as the Shag Harbor, the Westall Incident or even the famous 1952 Washington incident are just a handful of real UFO events which are hard to deny and equally hard to find conventional explanations, if there is indeed any.

Edited June 19, 2013 by Aethelwulf

[Moontanman]

This particular UFO sighting is spectacularly unconvincing but it cannot be used to denigrate other UFO sightings, there are sighting that have no conventional explanation, I can provide details of those sightings but I see no reason to fuel ridicule even from my favorite turtle... :o

[Turtle]

In my opinion and of Nick Pope, the kite explanation does not answer this Turtle.

 

Yes I know your opinion and the opinion you voice of Nick Pope, but as I have explained to you and the other readers this is because you both know Jack Squat about kites. Moreover you -if not Nick- give every indication you have neither the ability and/or inclination to learn about kites. Fear not, because every time you give me opportunity or cause I will remind you of the merit of your opinion on this incident.

 

This particular UFO sighting is spectacularly unconvincing but it cannot be used to denigrate other UFO sightings, there are sighting that have no conventional explanation, I can provide details of those sightings but I see no reason to fuel ridicule even from my favorite turtle... :o

 

 

Well my old friend of past alien & UFO'ish discourses, I could say that you saying you won't provoke me is itself provocative.

 

Still, I see no reason to ridicule you here for a little gentle barbing. I love you like a brother I don't know and/or may not have. Let's dance it out. :alien_dance:

 

Fear not, I can see a way that I could ridicule you here legitimately and most loquaciously! Remember you are under Oath, but if you lie no one will know so that's OK. Moontanman, on a scale of 1 to 13, 1 being no-chance-in-hell and 13 being positively-without-doubt, rank your confidence in my claim that as I described, a pair of kites looking like white circles above could be flown to 1300 feet by means available for over a century. [improvement in materials employed notwithstanding.]

 

Mind you that any answer other than 13 will be subject to inquiry, scrutiny, condescension, condensation, and other such means and manners of quibbleage as I see fit to employ.

:turtle:   :turtle:

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Edited June 20, 2013 by Turtle

[cal]

Let me give you a very brief example, in 1958 the avrocar, a saucer shaped vehicle was explored by the american government payed through Canadian taxes. In 1952 several UFO's where seen above my home town in Dunoon, witnessed by school children and a teacher. You start to question, how was something like this appearing in our airspace when no one was more advanced technologically-wise than the american government itself?

You're arguing against yourself here. I suggest that there is a team of scientists working on this, funded by the government, and then you say it can't be the government and now you're giving an example where it must be the government. Your argument confuses me.

 

Even our British one? Likely a saucer has crashed at one time and the real ''space race'' or as I like to call it, ''the cosmological race'' had transpired right under our noses! For who would be as strong as any other country than to have such technology? This is why Wilbert Smith of the Canadian Gov. said in a secret memo ''the UFO subject is a secret classed higher than the H-bomb.''

There's two things wrong with this argument. The first is that you say the memo is secret. Either you're lying or it's not a secret memo. By saying the memo is secret, but then quoting from it as if you had access to it somehow, you're perverting the definition of what it is for something to be secret. Secondly, UFO (Unidentified Flying Object) only stands for an aircraft that was in government-controlled airspace and wasn't publicly scheduled to be there, hence the "unidentified" aspect of the flying object. All foreign aircraft in US airspace are initially identified as UFO's if you've ever listened to radio chatter from the US Air Force. The term UFO is only used to describe aliens by people who don't understand the term UFO. That being said, if this memo (why a memo? why not a full document?) was talking about a government funded aircraft (which is what all military aircraft is), it makes sense that it be prioritized above hydrogen bombs, because aircraft cost more in aggregate to manufacture and fund research for (aircraft research is never-ending, they are always looking for better aircraft; the h-bomb has already been made, the research is done for it). I don't see anything in what you've quoted that suggests anything besides what I've been saying about it being a next-gen aircraft for the military. Another thing about this is that these are Canadians, and Canada is the country that Russia has to fly over for a direct route to America, making my statements about Russia's saucer ships more validated.

____________________________________

 

I'd like to add to Rade's list of possibilities.

 

3. It's just a man-made aircraft, like all the other ones.

____________________________________

 

So... when you look at this kite along its axis when it's horizontal, you [more or less see this. _____^_____ Not much of a radar target is it?

Turtle has a good point here, but drop this goddamn kite idea you are all going for lol. That shape, _____^_____, is the same shape a B2 stealth bomber makes when looked at horizontally, and the B2 has magnetic and energy dissipating coating, as well as a honey-comb composite construction of the chassis cover, reducing radar reflection even more. These things are called stealth for a reason, the B2 doesn't even show up on most radar systems unless it's like a hundred feet away. The fact that this supposed UFO showed up on radar at all suggests that it is NOT an alien aircraft.

Edited June 23, 2013 by Snax

[Aethelwulf]

You must understand, memo's in the american government, those written say by the FBI where once classified ''top secret.'' They had been declassified under the freedom of information act.

[Aethelwulf]

So, no, you don't understand I presume. Thousands of previously classified titled top secret memo's where hidden for years in the FBI vaults and it was only until the freedom of information acts did any of them get released. Plenty more are still kept in the hands of officials.

[Aethelwulf]

Put it this way ...

 

... because of the release of these previously top secret documents, no official statement from any FBI director can say that it is not within their jurisdiction to investigate the UFO phenomenon, just like Director C. Kelly had once misinformed the public. Thousands of these documents surfaced so we know for sure that the american government took the phenomenon very seriously.

[cal]

Put it this way ...

 

... because of the release of these previously top secret documents, no official statement from any FBI director can say that it is not within their jurisdiction to investigate the UFO phenomenon, just like Director C. Kelly had once misinformed the public. Thousands of these documents surfaced so we know for sure that the american government took the phenomenon very seriously.

Right, during the 50's, when "Roswell" happened, during the height of the red scare, when like I said, Russia was testing saucer-shaped aircraft and flying them over Canada into US airspace...

 

Really all you're doing is validating everything I've said here lol.

[Aethelwulf]

No you don't seem to understand... You said I was lying about saying the documents where top secret... they where. Then they where released under the freedom of information act.

 

And I can assure you, Russia was not building saucer shaped craft and flying them in US airspace. No conventional craft we are aware of, of saucer design makes good aviation.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avro_Canada_VZ-9_Avrocar

 

The avrocar (if this is what you are talking about) was created in Canada for the US military. It was top secret as well at the time. But the saucer barely got off the ground... this was at the height of the cold war; the Russians certainly where not flying saucers over Canada! You have your information terribly mixed up.

Edited June 23, 2013 by Aethelwulf

[Aethelwulf]

It raises questions why the american gov. took a sudden interest in saucer design for aircraft. You must also keep in mind saucer shaped craft had been seen in the skies years before this. Even in my own hometown, around 1952, a teacher and students witnessed several disks flying over the sky. This was before the avrocar was even designed!

 

The UFO phenomenon is real, and saucers where invading our skies and no doubt america was in a race to understand this technology. This was the real space race.

[Aethelwulf]

Also, not to mention that UFO's in general display technology which far exceeds our own... these objects made a mockery of fighter pilots over washington in 1952.

[cal]

No you don't seem to understand... You said I was lying about saying the documents where top secret... they where. Then they where released under the freedom of information act.

What does the American freedom of information act have to do with Canada's government? I might have to get an ankle brace for all these holes you're making me step in bro.

 

And I can assure you, Russia was not building saucer shaped craft and flying them in US airspace. No conventional craft we are aware of, of saucer design makes good aviation.

It's purpose is not for navigation within a planet's atmosphere, it's not that kind of craft...

 

The avrocar (if this is what you are talking about) was created in Canada for the US military. It was top secret as well at the time. But the saucer barely got off the ground... this was at the height of the cold war; the Russians certainly where not flying saucers over Canada! You have your information terribly mixed up.

It wasn't, it's what you're talking about. And again, you're confirming what I'm saying about these things being secrets, is this even dissent to my arguments anymore lol? The Russians picked up where the Nazi's left off. And they made these aircraft initially to spy on us, as we made all sorts of attempts to spy on them, and the shortest way to send a craft to spy on US is to send it over the polar cap and through Canada.

 

On the avrocar though, that appears to be using simple air-pressure propulsion, and I've seen other vertical-landing aircraft that uses combustible fuel propulsion, but neither of those things is what the Nazis had started working on. They used super-therma-fluids, which are incredibly dense, incredibly magnetic fluids, spinning very fast with massive centripetal force which theoretically creates an anti-gravito field. To be honest I think they got it to work, I don't believe in space nazis or any of that, but I think the team of scientists that were researching it probably got positive results. NASA "replicated" this experiment to try to dissuade people from believing that the Nazi's had a legitimate space program, but their replication was on a nickle-sized scale, about a thousand times smaller than the actual craft the Germans were using, so of course no noticeable changes in gravity's affect on the device were observed when NASA did it...

 

Anyways, I'm rambling now, but I think the point to all this is that your original post isn't aliens dude, it's probably some government thing, like it's always been.

Edited June 23, 2013 by Snax

[Aethelwulf]

Right, so you are actually talking about the Nazi Saucer program? Yes.

 

Right, so we can work from here. Do you have any reliable sources that the Russians took over the program? I have heard the Russians went to Antarctica to create an ice base - there was some speculation from authors that the base was going to be used as a secret saucer investigative unit. Outside of what little I know about that, I have never seen any evidence apart from speculation. I was also under the impression none of the Nazi saucers actually made it into production?

 

I think one of the methods of propulsion had to do with magnets rotating round a cylindrical vessel. Again, I don't know much more than this. Of course UFO's where appearing in the sky during the war, it is not entirely unreasonable to presume at least of one them came into the hands of the Nazi's which may have drove the ufo program they appeared to be working. As far as I am aware however, I do not believe at all that the Russians where advanced enough to understand how to create such an advanced piece of technology, if they had, getting into space would have been a piece of pie before the Americans. Even then I am sure, the American government was aware that objects of tremendous technology where pervading the airspace.

 

As for the avrocar, you are right, the reason why it hardly got off the ground was because it was a primitive propulsion system. I think the american government had their scientists wrapping their brains on finding methods of propulsion and the Coanda effect was one of the proposed engines. To the disappointment of high ranking officials, it was unsuccessful so they probably began to find new methods of propulsion. Keep in mind, the Roswell incident happened only 9 years before this. It is entirely reasonable to think that back-engineering of a crashed UFO gave them very little information - it's like handing a stop watch to an ancient civilization on Earth and then asking them how it works... only a limited amount of information can be extracted.

[Aethelwulf]

So no there are real problems thinking it was the government of any nation. The technology was simply not there. Even the best fighter pilots of the early 50's tried to intercept several UFO's which where found pervading the airspace over washington. The capitol was sent into a state of alarm.

 

Every time they attempted to intercept the object, they flew away at tremendous speeds; our early aviation capabilities cannot do this - in fact no country could have done it. Certainly not the Russians. Other advanced technology has been observed, the Tehran incident seen two fighter pilots have their technology blocked, control systems down, probably some kind of EM field produced by the object they were told to intercept. So we are not just dealing with incredible speeds unmatched by anything on earth, we are talking about a level of technology which can harness strong fields in local vicinities.

[Aethelwulf]

And don't even get me started on how many pilots working for the Military have in fact lost there lives trying to intercept these objects. Especially during the Cold War era, plenty documented cases... here is a nice story...

 

http://www.reuters.com/article/2008/10/22/us-britain-ufo-idUSTRE49L53Z20081022

[Aethelwulf]

Let me elaborate slightly on what we are dealing with. A specific subject in fact, Nick Pope working in the UFO project for the MoD took particular interest in... The Rendelshame forest incident. An entire platoon of military agents, even high ranking generals where involved in mysterious set of objects which penetrated not only the airspace of a strong british military stronghold in suffolk in 1980... five years before I was born. Dozens of USAF personnel where involved in the incident: We are in fact talking about not only the platoon of soldiers but also the high ranking officials who observed one of the best recorded UFO sightings ever to grace the world. To Nick Popes hate the MoD proposed the incident caused no major national security threat. Those involved clearly stated that anything that penetrated their base in such a way, was of serious security issues. This is one of the reasons why Nick Pope, said on many occasions that UFO's pose a serious threat not only to the safety of the public, but to the general defense of the country.

 

The intense situation of UFO's reached a height in the same year... the documented cases on official levels dropped a decade later but probably had something to do with a general remake in the appropriate conduct of the military itself. America was on the same lines decades before our own government... the denial and secrecy was implemented during the Roswell incident and then afterwards total denial of the existence of UFO's or simply ignoring the phenomenon was soon established. It was only about 2 years ago Washington officials made a public statement saying that UFO's posed no threat to national security. The white house had obviously forgotten what happened in 1952 (ironic joke) when several UFO's penetrated the US airspace, serious enough that several fighter pilots had been scrambled to intercept the objects... with very little luck. The general in command took offense when the white house said it was nothing but a weather phenomenon. The general said in separate interviews, that the military was not as stupid as to chase ghosts in the air and knowing fine well the objects where of intelligent control.

 

The coverup is more than astonishing. It is deep... deeper than the secrecy which involved the H-Bomb, according to high official Canadian gov. scientists Wilbert Smith. This is known because of a secret memo which was eventually released due to the freedom act. Like many of these documents/memo's large parts of them where censored. Nothing in the law due to national security permits that a document be released if to harm the identity of informants. So quite easily you can remove vital information, the smoking guns no less in the name of national laws.