All the Truth about 2012

[BLUE ELECTRIC MONKEY]

Well...it's more like 40+ pages of interesting meddling, but who's counting here anyway? :D

 

:D

What can I say, I opened the link, started reading, then saw it's 1..6, and then upto 12, and then it became 10+, which is also correct, and also an accurate enough definition for what I wanted to say, and can also show some bias I have about 10.

 

As good an accounting as any to conclude with. ;)

 

Naa...

That's letting it off the hook too easily.

"all you 2012-theorists, are just numerologists, which means your theory are bunk".

If you want to see more how this 2012 obsession manifests globally, you could use some basic understanding of their numerology (it's wise to know they talk about a date of 21.12.2012, if you want to understand).

And on the other hand, my 2012-theory is not numerology, at least with your definition of numerology with always using 9 as an Identity Element in numerological calculation as a rigorous mathematical definition.

:)

[BLUE ELECTRIC MONKEY]

A good way to conclude with, so far:

 

2012:

I don't believe there's anymore much to it than numbers affecting people, NOT NATURE.

Calenders are not designed in any way that can predict natural disasters. They are constructed in a way that corresponds to the natural cycle of nature and mankind to some extant with seasons and weekends and holidays and other mainly sun & moon related cycles.

They are not constructed in a way that can predict, or cause, a natural disaster, but in a way that can make some people feel some things, sometimes.

[Turtle]

:D

What can I say, I opened the link, started reading, then saw it's 1..6, and then upto 12, and then it became 10+, which is also correct, and also an accurate enough definition for what I wanted to say, and can also show some bias I have about 10.

 

Roger that. A Golden Ratio biscuit for reading that far. :D :)

 

Naa...

That's letting it off the hook too easily.

"all you 2012-theorists, are just numerologists, which means your theory are bunk".

If you want to see more how this 2012 obsession manifests globally, you could use some basic understanding of their numerology (it's wise to know they talk about a date of 21.12.2012, if you want to understand).

And on the other hand, my 2012-theory is not numerology, at least with your definition of numerology with always using 9 as an Identity Element in numerological calculation as a rigorous mathematical definition.

:D

 

Well, the first sentence is a quote from someone else. However, I did put 'numerology is bunk' in the title of my earlier reply.

 

While you're munching that biscuit, you might consider that my Katabatak exploration is decidedly not only identity element 9, which manifests when using base 10, but rather I investigate all bases, and so identity elements.

 

I agree people have a fixation with numbers, but then we human folk have a lot of fixations with patterns. Whether or not those patterns inform us is the prize. ;)

 

PS Here's a few threads at Hypog on the 2012 business:

http://hypography.com/forums/strange-claims-forum/8076-the-2012-prophecies.html

 

http://hypography.com/forums/social-sciences/10870-mayan-tzolkin.html

 

http://hypography.com/forums/strange-claims-forum/13165-2012-conspiracy-theories.html

 

http://hypography.com/forums/astronomy-and-cosmology/10192-our-galactic-plane.html

[BLUE ELECTRIC MONKEY]

Some questions and answers about numbers and nature and 2012.

 

> wait so nothing happened or moved before the advent of numerical

systems? so in the era of pre-history... you've got people who weren't

affected by nature because numbers didn't exist?

 

> I think that there are many that were killed by exposure and

predators that would have a different opinion of that.

 

You seem to misunderstand.

Number-of-dates affect humans, not nature. This is the issue.

Many things happened before the advent of numerical systems, but not

so much as massive human-made destruction. This was a later development.

This is not about not being affected by nature, but by numbers. in

pre-history no one would be anxious about 2012 or other number

formalizations of time.

 

All people who were killed by exposure and predators would probably

have a different opinion about everything, but I guess they wouldn't

say most of the attacks were on a specific pattern of dates, or that

one date become a symbol of an attack, or something like that, nor

would they say that being eating by a dinosaur is a

human-made-destruction, unless someone drove them into the animal's mouth.

 

> sure animals would understand something like a 28 day cycle where

more nocturnal predators would be out hunting because other animals

were out in larger numbers because it was easier to see. So if there

was intelligence in the animal you'd peg it to the number 28?

 

I suggest we use the matrix model I showed (nothing to do with the

movie, but with the artificial matrix of number obsessions and the

natural source of our counting systems, the 10 fingers)

Now, what natural cycles in nature, which we can define with numbers

and days, are there ?

We got many.

We got the "sun cycles", basically, the day and the year.

This affects nature a lot, we get light and darkness periods, we get

seasons, we also get basic counting.

We got the "moon cycles", (day/night semi-cycle of

appearing/disappearing, but still in a different manner every

day/night, relative to the steady SUN) and a more basic

lunar-moon-month cycle, with effects of new-moon/full-moon, and tides,

and a correlation to many other natural cycles in nature, such as the

human female menstrual cycle.

Other cycles, are also according to the planets, and the constellations.

There are about 7 classical planets, each with some uniqueness

attributed to it in each day on the week, showing some possible

correlation to nature (like each one of them is closest to the sun,

relatively, from Earth's viewpoint, and also the Sun is seen as moving

through different "background of stars" as seen from earth, which is

divided to 12 or 13 constellations, usually, in according to the cycle

of the moon, originally.

(Hebrew new moon is always a new month, and many celebrations are in

the middle of the month, on the full moon, The Hebrew calender goes by

the moon and the sun, thus using a 12 months years, with a 13 moon

year every few of years, on a fixed cycle, causing the same holidays

to appear always in the same seasons and in the same moon-phase)

Some basic astrological FACTs we can show so far:

It's possible to assume that people that are born in the summer are

somewhat statistically different from those that are born in the

winter-time.

It's possible to assume that the summer is hotter and the winter is

cold and rainy, in the northern hemisphere, almost always, and this

seems to be the way it goes forever, even with possible "pole

shifting" (think about it if you need to).

 

Now, what happens with calenders and other artificial (human-made)

number-using ?

You use a counting system based on 10 fingers.

The intelligence you referred to in the above-mentioned-animal, will

be activated not by "counting 28's", but by this possible "analogy to

counting in the animal kingdom":

- I count much light in night, so I go to hunt

- I count much animals I can eat, so I know it's good to do it.

(possibility, the first is enough of course for most predators, and

other animals that are attracted to light, with bugs being a common

example, which could be widely and wisely used by the predators)

- I count less light in night, and then more light at night and then

less and then more, so I know that the more I reach closer to the

maximum, I should be in the place where I saw most animals, and I

should come closer to it, if I see the light-night is getting stronger

each-"day", and in the maximum-light-night I'm going to be there for

sure. Mmm, maybe I should convince others that my counting is good, I

might yell and shout in full moon to convince my fellow predators that

it's the numerological-feeding-time.

- If I had intelligence I would build a calender to make us all go

together to hunt on full moon without having to shout and scream about

it, but I have 16 fingers on 4 limbs, so I will count this cycle of

feeding-time differently from animals who don't hunt, don't believe

the full moon affect nature as I do, don't feed at night but do other

things at night that they can see better under the moon, stand on 2

legs, use 10 fingers, 5 of them usually more than others, and 1 finger

in each hand is opposite to the others, and they don't seem to have a

tail on themselves to count with.

 

Interesting to add:

The cycle of the week/weekend is believed to be of a religious

biblical source and not of normal nature. It is nice to see that the

name for Saturday, both in English and in Hebrew, shows a linguistic

connection to the planet of Saturn (Shabtai in Hebrew, Saturday is

Shabat, or Sabbath in English translation of the concept)

(The classical list of planets is obviously "not accurate enough",

since they count the sun and the moon (reflected in the western

calender as Sunday and Monday), and only other 5 planets, but this

might be also corresponding to some natural-effect-of-the-universe as

seen from earth, and also corresponds to the 28-days moon cycle,

dividing it to 4 basic halves (one half, and then another half of each

half, I don't divide the moon cycles to thirds, but to halves, and I

get a pretty good correspondence to new-moon, half-moon, full-moon,

half-moon, which is also in according with cycles of sex, since the

cycles of sex are affected by moon-periods, and by weekends, in some

way that can naturally reflect our "forgotten"

full-moon-hunting-obsessions.

 

> Numbers are just a representation of something. Sure there are some

cultures that are very wary of numbers, but there are many that are

not at all. I'd say that numerical fears are passed on via nurture

since there is no rational reason for nature to pass it on.

 

Doesn't have to be "nurture" per se.

Calenders are, as you said, numbers that represent something, or a

numero-system of time of a year. And when you represent the number of

the calender based on a counting system of 10-fingers, that can cause

"possible fears, not directly connected to nurture".

 

When are we afraid of dates ?

1.

When money is involved, usually without any connection to Nature. we

get our salaries and pay our taxes on a money-calender, and it can

cause some fears about it.

2.

When the year is getting close to its end.

Many people feel that "wow, time goes by so fast, I don't notice this,

hey, I'm getting older, could it be 2008 already ?"

Nothing really connected to nature, but to the representations of

numbers (some are more depressed on the winter anyway, of course, but

some calenders end in the summer and causes a "ending effect" without

the possible winter-depression.

Different "human made calender" also can cause us fears:

The school year calender is quite artificial and fixed, and causes

many possible fears, like when the vacation is Ending.

Many things in society go by an artificial calender: TV broadcasts on

specific seasons and precise hours, "work-calender"

"tax-year-calender" "birthday-calender" "school calender"

"dead-lines-calender" "reviews calender", and so forth.

Also, when the Mayan calender is over, some fears can be created, and

as shown above, fears about the end of time, are (in 3 main cultures)

with complete symbolic analogy to the fear/faiths of the end of the

year-calender (of the same culture).

3.

When dates remind us of things we fear, or if specific dates "succeed"

to frighten us. or if specific dates cause people to do "bad stuff"

(more, statistically), as if they are in a full-moon-hunt.

All this Reminding, and possible outbreaks, are all using the

artificial way we represent dates, an artificial representations of

time, always using some 10-fingers-counting-side-effects, even if it

is built as much as possible to conform to the natural cycles of the

year / moon / week / day / rest-of-nature, and even when counting

hours and minutes and seconds, with artificial models built on

previous artificial models:

24 hours a day, on two 12 cycles of numbers, as the day is the "sun

cycle", and the sun-cycle is connected to 12-moons-possibility, and is

more easily handled, humanly-fingerly-digitally-mathematically, than a

13-hours cycles

60 minutes and 60 seconds show both the X0 pattern of

10-digits-systems, and is also connected to 12, as it is 12 * 5 (we

have 5 fingers), and contains the 6 digits, which is half of 12 (I

already now 5 is half of 10 with my fingers, and I think half is more

important than third, because I divide my 10 fingers to two hands,

when counting, not to 3 hands, and I also think that multiplying by 5

is more easily understood, when you have 5 fingers in each hand, and

not 3, or 4, or some kind of difference between the number of toes and

fingers)

 

Yes, I appreciate the Mayan-2012 people who aspire to using a calender

that is more according to nature.

But you don't need to replace one artificial calender with another

one. (you can say it's not artificial and designed by a divine entity,

but you can't understand and use it without using your basic models of

counting with 10 fingers, or without models of counting using the

basic 10-counting model).

If freedom from time is what you want, after 2012 my theory shows time

will be less dangerous and less charming, as far as human-destruction

and charm go.

If freedom from your calender is what you want, that consider that a

freedom from A calender is what you want.

If a natural cycle calender is what you want, just look at nature

directly,

If a natural-based calender is what you want, all calender are

naturally based somehow, and the basic naturals things about it are:

Earth, Sun, Moon, Day, Month, Year, Week, and a 10-fingers-human.

If you think the western calender should be replaced because it bad,

and evil, and enforcing unnatural structures, please note that after

2012, it will be less "evil", less "charming", and thus, "less

composing unnatural numbers".

 

(for all those who forgot or don't know: "Digit" originally means

"Finger", check it out)

[Tormod]

(for all those who forgot or don't know: "Digit" originally means

"Finger", check it out)

 

Yeah, in English. How about Norwegian?

 

Siffer != Finger.

 

I think most of your argument simply falls on the fact that language is a cultural construct, and mathematics is bound to follow linguistic rules when we're not talking about global signs. Thus terms like "digit", "date", "cycle", "matrix" etc will have different meanings in different cultures.

[BLUE ELECTRIC MONKEY]

Yeah, in English. How about Norwegian?

 

Siffer != Finger.

 

I think most of your argument simply falls on the fact that language is a cultural construct, and mathematics is bound to follow linguistic rules when we're not talking about global signs. Thus terms like "digit", "date", "cycle", "matrix" etc will have different meanings in different cultures.

 

Well, I said "digit", not "Siffer"....

 

All in all, what you say is not so accurate, all known cultures are counting with their fingers.

[Turtle]

Well, I said "digit", not "Siffer"....

 

All in all, what you say is not so accurate, all known cultures are counting with their fingers.

 

Not exactly, as some count with other body parts and in addition, not everyone has 10 fingers. :shrug:

 

Why we use our fingers and toes to count - Telegraph

Intriguingly, the precise region in the parietal lobes where this skill resides - the "intraparietal sulcus" - also controls finger movement. It is no accident that finger counting is an almost universal stage in the child's learning of arithmetic (though it is unclear where one ancient New Guinea culture fits in - it has a 33 base system, which includes toes, testicles and penis, said Prof Butterworth). ...

 

THE GREAT 7; OR: IF JOHNNY VON NEUMANN HAD LEARNED THE SEPTIMAL SYSTEM IN SCHOOL

6. A SIXTH FINGER OF THE HAND

 

On the example of Roman numbers I gave a reasoning that materially it is natural to count by fives (or of course, by tens) but not so by sixes. One hand is 5 fingers. You then can show naturally and easily 1, 2, 3, 4 and finally 5. But with one hand you cannot show naturally and easily 6; and with two hands it is not natural to stop at 6 (or 7). And still, simple Uralic numbers do not go beyond 6.

 

Of course, if you want merely show 6, it can be done; e.g. you can show your open hand for "5" (5 fingers) and a closed fist for "6". But then still you cannot count on your fingers.

 

Excepting exceptional members of the community having 6 fingers per hands. The Magyars until 1000 AD, the Man'shis and Khantis until the XXth century had shamanistic religions; and originally the shaman was the intellectual expert of the tribe. And the shaman must have had extra bones. Extra tooth is good; but extra finger is the best. In Russian museums lots of shaman costumes can be found, frequently with gloves for six, even seven fingers [3]. While 7 fingers on one hand is clearly mere boasting, 6 fingers on at least one hand of a shaman is rather a rule; if somebody is born with 6 fingers, he will be the apprentice of the shaman while young. Maybe the Laurence-Moon-Biedl syndrome is behind [4]. While in the typical case this syndrome produces obesity + polydactily + mental defects + retinal problems, in close kins often only the obesity and the polydactily seem to appear. Now, observe that the able shaman can very easily fall into trance, which, no doubt, would be classified by a physician as some neural/mental disorder. So, indeed, polydactily is a real indicator for shamanistic ability; who knows how good?

 

If the theoretic expert of the tribe had 6 fingers, he could naturally count on his fingers in Base 6, and common members of the tribe accepted the results or emulated the method with pebbles, twigs, closed fists &c.

 

Hungarian science has the necessary data. Unfortunately until now no Hungarian historian of mathematics was interested in the stage of Base 6. In pure mathematical sense, of course, this counting is trivial.

 

I asked in Chapter 5: whose symbol is W=6? The answer is then: W symbolizes the polydactilic hand of the spiritual leaders of the steppe tribes. ...

[BLUE ELECTRIC MONKEY]

Hey, thanks for this post, Turtle !

 

Not exactly, as some count with other body parts and in addition, not everyone has 10 fingers. :shrug:

 

I didn't say "only with fingers"....

Do you know of a culture that doesn't use fingers in their counting ?

 

>>>

(though it is unclear where one ancient New Guinea culture fits in - it has a 33 base system, which includes toes, testicles and penis, said Prof Butterworth).

 

How does this add up to 33 ? I got 23...

 

All in all, all counting systems in all cultures have a "natural source" of counting with body-parts.

[Turtle]

Hey, thanks for this post, Turtle !

 

I didn't say "only with fingers"....

Do you know of a culture that doesn't use fingers in their counting ?

 

>>>

(though it is unclear where one ancient New Guinea culture fits in - it has a 33 base system, which includes toes, testicles and penis, said Prof Butterworth).

 

How does this add up to 33 ? I got 23...

 

All in all, all counting systems in all cultures have a "natural source" of counting with body-parts.

 

If your interested in the 33, then I suggest it is a good topic for your next research. All in all, since it is people who are doing the counting then trying to differentiate 'natural source' is not even wrong.

 

I'm looking for the study from Ohio State on Crows counting but have only found a bibliography of studies and no actual paper. :shrug: In any regard, do you suppose Crows can count to five because they have 5 toes? :doh:

 

Selected References on the American Crow,

[CraigD]

The Mesoamerican numeral system used by the Long Count calendar under which the 2012 date is so remarkable is actually base 20 (vigesimal, a pretty cool vocabulary word), not base 10 (or 23 or 33 :shrug:).

 

It’s actually pretty easy to use, though it doesn’t render well into ASCII character. On the other hand, any numerate person could figure out its meaning at a glance, while if you don’t know the Arabic numeral system glyphs 0 through 9, it’d take you a while to figure them out from examples (there’s actually a children’s puzzle that involves doing just that, using letters, strange squiggles, or the usual European glyphs assigned different meaning - it’s not in general an easy puzzle), and it is easier than Arabic numerals to write in clay or sand.

 

Here’s the Arabic numeral arithmetic

167333 
      +
50644 
      =
217977

In Mayan:

.             .
               
      .      ..
0      ____   ____
               
...             
____           
____   .       
____   ____   ....
               
             ...
      ..     ____
.      ____   ____
____   ____   ____
           
             ..
...           ____
____          ____
____   ....   ____
          
    +      =

You can use the Mayan glyphs (0 . _) for any base system, something handy to keep in mind if you’re every trying to do math with someone who’s never seen the European numeral glyphs, or if you find yourself with nothing but dirt or sand to write in.

[BLUE ELECTRIC MONKEY]

If your interested in the 33, then I suggest it is a good topic for your next research.

 

I got some good 33 and King-David stuff.

(don't really know anything about crow-counting or counting-crows)

King David is the first Israeli king of Jerusalem, City of God, and is a beloved character in Judaism (Main messiah-king-character), In Christianity (Jesus son of David, King of the Jews), and in Islam (Called Daud, Father of the also-beloved-by-all-three-Suliman, is the one to whom the Zabur (psalms) were given, as the Tawrat (The law) was given to Musa (Moses), and as the Iglis (Gospel) was given to Isa (Jesus son of Mary), but is also not-accurate in Islam, since they consider all these 3 to have been corrupted by humans and writing and copying and are not original documents as the Koran, the Muslim Bible.)

 

David ruled 33 years in Jerusalem and he is also number 33 in the Dynasty of Man:

Adam, Sheth, Enosh, ...., Noah (10), .... Abraham (20), Issac, Jacob/Israel, Judah, Peretz, Hezron, Ram, Aminadav, Nahshon, Shalmon, Boaz, Oved, Jesse, David.

 

Now 33 is a palindrome, and so is David in Hebrew: DVD, and also his Hebrew father, Jesse: YShY, so actually David son of Jesse is "Palindrome son-of Palindrome" (First two palindromes in this dynasty of Man, if we're excluding the first palindromes of language: ABA (dad) and A(I)MA (mom) (pronounced IMA, written as AMA), and also excluding the other 3-letters-Hebrew-palindrome in the family: uncle (also DVD)).

(Also: The Hebrew EVE and SIS' are not palindromes)

 

Let's just add that:

1. King David prime number, if at all, is 7, not 33. (not only a mathematical prime, OK science forum ?)

 

2. 3-letters-palindromes in Hebrew is a bigger subject than discussed here, and if you'd like a list of them tell me.

 

3. An hypothesis of mine:

ALL languages have at least one word for dad, and at least one word for mom that are either:

(now don't get smart with me, I will gladly change this hypothesis to Most Human Languages)

a. 3-letters-palindrome (mom, dad, ABA, AMA, PAP....)

b. starting with a 3-letter-palindrome (MAMa, MAMiminia, DADa, DADdy)

My suggested explanation:

Babies start learning language somehow mainly pronouncing one consonant and one vowel, and repeating themselves)

 

4. Most 33-obsessions and -Internet-Numerology I heard about can be connected to this:

a. Freemasonry has 33 "degrees", and they are "free temple builders", and Jerusalem is the City of the Temple.

b. All Jewish And/Or Christian And/Or God And/Or Western And/Or Secret-societies And/Or Western-politics And/Or World-domination-concepts conspiracy-theories, somehow connected to 33, can be attributed to this.

c. If you really want to show me that 33 is about more than that, we should consider 33's in Eastern Cultures.

d. If the month has up to 31 days, then 32 is something "beyond" some concept of limitation in time-counting, and 33 is "beyond the beyond" (a "word-palindrome")

[BLUE ELECTRIC MONKEY]

The Mesoamerican numeral system used by the Long Count calendar under which the 2012 date is so remarkable is actually base 20 (vigesimal, a pretty cool vocabulary word), not base 10 (or 23 or 33 :hihi:).

 

I think we've already shown some possible natural-source-counting-with-body-parts, that can mainly give us a 10 base counting, and also possible 20, 23, and 33's, as with toes, and fingers and more possibilities.

 

I must say here some things about the Hebrew Language and about the Hebrew Counting, which revolve around 22 letters/numbers/digits and 10-digits.

The Body-parts-analogy given in Hebrew Mystical Numerological texts, says that 22 is "given" with 10 fingers, 10 toes, and the sexual organ and the tongue.

I guess this is how it goes in the numerology of a Circumcised Hebrew reality-tunnel.

But this is just a possible explanation, the facts are:

 

1. Every Hebrew letter is attributed to one of 22 numbers: 1..10, 20, 30, .., 90 ,100, 200, 300, 400

2. This is used in all counting. It is used also in numerology, but more than that, in the Hebrew Calender dating system.

So today is the Hebrew date of:

27th of the first month, or the 7th month, in 5769

This is the first month of 5769, but when Hebrew months are given numbers, it is also sometimes the 7th month.

You write it:

K"Z B-TISHREY (HA)-ThShST

Pronounced Kuf-Zayin Be-THISREY (HA)-TA-SHA-SA-T

KZ (K is the 11th letter of the Hebrew Alphabet, counting as 20, and Z iz the 7th (in English G), so this means 20+7, or 27th)

B- means IN, as in OF.

TISHREY is the name of the month, not its number.

Th-400, Sh-300, S-60, T-9, so this means 769

And Ha in the beginning of the year, is occasionally used to say it's 5000, while it's not important for practical calender-uses, and while H count as 5, and this in the date is accepted to mean 5*1000.

Not all counting is so simple, some letters that appear in "the name of God" are "sacred" so you never write 15 and 16 as YH or YV (10+5, 10+6), but you write them as TV and TZ (9+6, 9+7), manifesting in the calender mostly around the time of the full moon.

 

This shows that Hebrew counting mainly uses a system of both 10-digits (and 10 basic numbers and 10 fingers and 10-multiplications) and both a 22-letters-counting-system.

(which is quite basic, and can be expanded for "initials", "adding-digits-numerology", "different-final-letters-numeric-value", other-mental gymnastics and more, but today mostly in the official calender)

 

2.

The Hebrew 22 letters are quite "original",

See the invention of the alphabet in wikipedia.

Basically,

Before that people used "signs for words" and other expressions, and at one point in time they started to use written signs for letters, thus using a final-alphabet for an unbounded-words-vocabulary.

Science now believes that modern alphabets have originated in Israel/Sinai/Egypt and are based of an old 22-letters alphabet, with a strong one-to-one correlation to the still-used-Hebrew-Alphabet (however changed in writing and in pronouncing, but with the same order and length and even "meaning of the name of the letter" - D(4) is a door, G(3) is a camel, V(6) is a hook....), and from which, science believes, most alphabets originated.

Thus you can see some correlation between the Hebrew and English order of letters, e.g.:

A,B,G,D - A,B,C,D

H (5) - E

K (20,11th letter) - K

Z (7) - G

I/Y (10) - J (All English Names for Biblical People and for God that have J, have I/Y (10) in Hebrew)

Last 4 letters: Kuf, Resh, Shin, Tav, K,R,Sh,Th

Reminds someone of Q,R,S,T ?

This correlation is in most other (human) alphabets as well.

 

3.

The Hebrew language allows/enables:

a. to use the body-parts of the mouth and tongue in the spoken language, and the signs of the operations of the mouth and tongue in the written language.

b. to use the same symbols for digits (originally digits are symbols of the hands, not of the of mouth).

c. to use the "holy name of god" in written language while keeping it out of the spoken language, thus creating a language structure with a symbol for "that which is beyond spoken language", even if this is a signifier without a signified.

(this has also some effect on the visual aspects of language, and shows that the Hebrew language is not only about language-that-can-be-said-and-heard-and-numbered)

d. to use words in the female form (the Hebrew female is Nekeva, which means pinhole, aperture, and allows you to use the female-organ-concept in order to create female-concepts-in-language).

(you use the same "letters/digits" for 3 men and 3 women, but the word-for-Three is different).

e. Monotheism and more, "no more of those confusing hyrogliphs and strange symbols of Egypt telling us what to do and how to think"

 

4.

2012 can be seen as 10 and 22 in basic numerology, and once again we can see a natural source for the 2012 obsessions, especially if we go by the computer-science definition of considering human-language as natural (relatively to artificial (computer) languages).

[Turtle]

4. Most 33-obsessions and -Internet-Numerology I heard about can be connected to this:

a. Freemasonry has 33 "degrees", and they are "free temple builders", and Jerusalem is the City of the Temple.

b. All Jewish And/Or Christian And/Or God And/Or Western And/Or Secret-societies And/Or Western-politics And/Or World-domination-concepts conspiracy-theories, somehow connected to 33, can be attributed to this.

c. If you really want to show me that 33 is about more than that, we should consider 33's in Eastern Cultures.

d. If the month has up to 31 days, then 32 is something "beyond" some concept of limitation in time-counting, and 33 is "beyond the beyond" (a "word-palindrome")

 

My own 33 obsession began a couple decades ago when it began appearing to me an inordinate amount of times in comparison to other numeration. Page numbers, clocks, sport uniforms on newscasts, receipt totals, yada yada yada. Anymore when it shows up I just take it as a gesture from the world in the vein that whether I know it or not, the Universe is laughing behind my back. Deteriorata! :)

 

the "beyond the beyond" is technically not a word palindrome as it does not read the same forward as back. Here is a proper word palindrome: madam i'm adam

[BLUE ELECTRIC MONKEY]

the "beyond the beyond" is technically not a word palindrome as it does not read the same forward as back. Here is a proper word palindrome: madam i'm adam

 

OH ! Math guys

I wrote ("word palindrome") and not (word palindrome)....

as in not letter-palindrome.

so MY def of letter-palindrome is "reads the same if you read the letters backwards"

and a "word-palindrome" is "reads the same if you read the words backwards"

so your example is a technical-word-palindrome and "beyond-the-beyond" is a "word-palindrome", OK ?

Now about your example, as opposed to mine, but as with the ones I showed above with letters, do you see some "connections" to the dynasty of Man and David and Family-Members, in "Adam" and in "Madam" ?

[Turtle]

OH ! Math guys :)

I wrote ("word palindrome") and not (word palindrome)....

as in not letter-palindrome.

so MY def of letter-palindrome is "reads the same if you read the letters backwards"

and a "word-palindrome" is "reads the same if you read the words backwards"

so your example is a technical-word-palindrome and "beyond-the-beyond" is a "word-palindrome", OK ?

Now about your example, as opposed to mine, but as with the ones I showed above with letters, do you see some "connections" to the dynasty of Man and David and Family-Members, in "Adam" and in "Madam" ?

 

:) Do you think I picked my example at random? :D We can make any connections we care, but as I say, if those connections don't inform us then I see no practical use of them. People are bio-electric pattern recognition machines and try as we might we can not sense anything without patternizing it.

 

I'm doing a word-for-word study of Buckminster Fuller's magnum opus, Synergetics over in the Philosophy section & if you haven't run across it I think you might find it of interest. While I'm not doing any skipping ahead over there, Fuller did write a section in Synergetics on Numerology and here is a link to that section: 1200.00 NUMEROLOGY

[BLUE ELECTRIC MONKEY]

My own 33 obsession began a couple decades ago when it began appearing to me an inordinate amount of times in comparison to other numeration. Page numbers, clocks, sport uniforms on newscasts, receipt totals, yada yada yada.

 

I also read some info about 33, in Robert Anton Wilson's books, like Cosmic Trigger, and amongst other things, He talks about the 33 longitude (north), on which (atlas) line (not a real line on a sphere, but in all maps), a lot of important things are happening, and many major cities are on it and so forth.

He also suggests, that Modern Culture is historically "moving to the west"

(pre-greekS, greek, rome, western europe and england, east US coast, west US coast, and possibly continuing / returning to the "far east" in some time)

it might be moving on that line in some manner or statistics.

The moving west is not the issue here, I have no problem at all thinking about human culture as "trying to adjust its movements to the sun", but what do you think about this 33 longitude ?

(let's suppose it's "true" - that really more important stuff is around 33'N)

(I'm around 32'50'' N, where are you ?)

Isn't it safe to say the number effect here is negligent, and if anything it's the shape of the Earth alone which can cause something like that ? Or would you add the way we draw flat maps to the possible cause, or would we even have to really consider the way we number degrees in considering this possible phenomenon ?

[BLUE ELECTRIC MONKEY]

These are some replies to questions about the above posts:

(originally asked by WhatsUpWithThis)

 

Enlightening,.... NOT! Believe that non answer bull then I'm selling stock in the bridge to no-where too? Sumerian text goes back to 3350 - 4000 B.C.E. Cuniform Tablets and Cyllinder Seals. Add that up on your fascinating 10 digits, then state when Hebrew alphabet was "invented"?

 

Please don't confuse all writings with alphabetical texts.

 

Sumarian writings state stories almost exact to what is in the bible too. Coincidence?

 

Please give me 100 stories that appear in both sources.

In my estimate, most "similarities" refer to Genesis, and not so much to the rest of the Hebrew Bible.

 

The main differences seem to be how humans were created and where we are located in the Galaxy. The Hebrews say Heaven, Sumerians say Space men.

 

The Hebrew Bible never talks about "heaven" but about the "Garden of Eden", which in the text is ON EARTH, and from the same Earth, man was created in the story. Nothing at all do to with outer space, or with the skies and the clouds.

 

2012 is coming my friend, We are passing through the Galactic Plain and the combination of gravity, solar flares, and asteroid bombardments, if they don't eliminate humans, will curtainly wreak havoc on earth for up to a year.

 

How can it be that we are getting closer and closer to the plain the milky way, and we don't notice it ?

Havoc on Earth for a year, is something humanity is known to survive.

Is there any proof to this ? I mean PROOF.

How does gravity change ? we're still in the same distance from the center of the galaxy anyway.

Why should we expect solar flares ?

I heard we should expect "more light" since the sun and the the galaxy-center will be in the same direction.

Well this happens to some extant every December (if I understood correctly), and Dec has the least amount of light anyway on the northern half of Earth.

And Asteroid Bombardments ? Are we actually going to be in 2012, in a place in the universe which is filled with asteroids ? Is it so hard to prove this scientifically ?

Most 2012-galactic claims, show some physical phenomenon is expecting us. Why is so hard to to prove any of it ?

 

So now you can stop your counting lesson and who counts how and why. The allignment of the stars is what runs calendars.

 

No, what runs calenders, is the movement of the Earth around the Sun, and around itself, and also the movement of the moon, as seen from earth. All other stars/planets/constellations that appear in calenders somehow, have a lesser effect, and they are considered as "seen from Earth", and not with some other alignment considerations.

 

Want to explain to the public WHY the Mayan Calendar was found a long time ago, studied, then re-buried without telling the public about it?

 

Not really.

 

Seems pretty familiar that goes along with the story in the movie StarGate starring Kurt Russell and James Spader?

 

I see more similarities between the concept of STAR-GATE and 2012-Theories, than between STAR-GATE and why the Old Mayan Calender didn't reach the public eye some few hundred years ago (a lot of other calenders of other conquered cultures, where found, studied, and never reported to "the public")

 

They then called in a Teacher familiar with Ancient Writings, Daniel Jackson(James Spader) to decypher it, figured it out, and got to use it.

 

So what's wrong with trying to decypher calenders with an ancient counting of ten fingers ?

 

This is a crazy nightmare now though. We have conspiracy theorists and debunkers uniting to cause utter chaos on the net and making everyone look like a bunch of looney toons by posting daily videos. "I thinks this is what's gonna happen people, I swear it's true!" I LAUGH!

 

Yes, a lot of people are posting such remarks on my posts, either trying to say I'm a loon, or "this is what's gonna happen, this is the truth"

I also try to laugh about it. :shrug:

 

The Sumerians had written laws about Astronomy, Architecture, Agriculture, Education, Economics, Government, Health, Religion, [still translating Sumerians tablets and cylinder seals at numerous colleges to see what else unfolds.]. Someone said that the Sumerians thought the Earth was disk shaped? What if a mistranslation happened and they said that our Galaxy was disk shaped?

 

Our galaxy IS disk shaped:

(and this is why you can talk about its "galactic plain")

Milky Way - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Barred spiral galaxy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Spiral galaxy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

How do you translate the galaxy into a word back then? Most likely through a picture in a cyllinder seal. Now the Center with triangles is not the sun, but it means center of our galaxy with black hole represented by triangles pointing in and out around a circle. Surrounding dots representing the planets, are the sun and planets! Now use your numerology to explain away.....

 

No, but I'll use body-parts !

Both the modern name for "the milkey way" and the word for "galaxy" are originated in Greek Mythology, and, according to the myth, the milky-way/galaxy is "caused" by milk coming out of the breast of the Queen of the Gods (in the middle of breastfeeding Hercules, I think)

In the Bible, there's one known event when someone is looking at the stars:

Abraham tries to count, and compares the image in his mind with the concept of "your seed"

(the Hebrew word for seed is the same as the Hebrew word for sperm)

Ancient Cultures usually viewed the creation of the world as caused by the body-parts of the gods.

The creation of Man is known to revolve around the operations of body-parts, of-course,

but also in many creation myths, we see the World is made with:

The sexual organ of the god/goddess/both (including womb)

The Children of the gods

The hands and spittle and other parts of the gods

Or as a direct result from the union between a male god and a female goddess (as in Hindu Tantra)

When we reach an Alphabetic-text as the bible, the world is seen as created with Speech.

 

See some pictures of the milky way, as a (spiral) disk, and as a "milky-way":

 

"milky way" - Google Image Search

Or just google "milky way" and look at the pictures.

 

Blue Electric Monkey