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Debate about something to do with security clearances


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11 minutes ago, OceanBreeze said:

Are you a US citizen?

Because, if you are not, you have just been caught in a lie.

"While non–U.S. citizens can work with technical information after approval from the Departments of Commerce or State, they could not be authorized to possess U.S. security clearances. There are situations where they can access classified information, but it is only after a deliberate need is identified, rationale is determined, and the access is granted after a favorable background check. However, in no situation is this the granting of a security clearance."

 

That’s the sort of lie that can can cost you that Top Secret clearance that you don’t have.😤

 

 

 

Actually no, clearly you do not know how security works in the military and NATO and NATO friends. 

I live in Australia, we are not part of NATO, but we do work very closely with NATO and the US, Australia is part of 'The Five eyes' security system. 

Your NSA and our ASIO are the same things and they work together, as such as an Australian I held, I had (still have) a clearance of Top Secret (special crypto), Australia or the US it is the highest security clearly that is given out. (although 'code word' and such is higher, but even then I had access to be communications, so in the course of my work I could view them. 

Some of the equipment I worked on was manufactured by a company called NSA (yes that NSA). 

The Security clearance is issued to me by the Australian Government with the NSA and ASIO, you do not need to be a US citizen or to live in the US to hold a US (NATO) security clearance. (remember Australia is not even in NATO, you could argue the US/AU alliance is closer than NATO. 

I have an Australian Security clearance, but that clearance is as good and of the same level as a US issued clearance.

But thanks for jumping to conclusions and assumptions and calling me a liar, good show.. 

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There are situations where they can access classified information, but it is only after a deliberate need is identified, rationale is determined, and the access is granted after a favorable background check. 

Yes, that is exactly how security works EVERYWHERE, you don't get or have a clearance and expect you can just walk in and do what you like, it does not work that way, it has never worked that way.

I held a TS/SC level 6 security clearance, there were places I could not go, or if I had to go there everything would be covered and I would have an escort watching me all the time.

We boil that down to "ON A NEED TO KNOW BASIS", that is how security works, everywhere. 

So you call me a liar and then explain that I am not a liar, because you state the obvious that "there are situations where...." Yes, so do you now accept that someone saying they have a clearance that is good in the US, issued and mandated by the NSA (in the US). That allows me to achieve a 'deliberate need, rationale to have access, after I have a favorable background check.

Are you going to apologies now?

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It is amazing how you just keep making up sh1t!

Your exact words were “I held the highest security clearance that the US can give out,

For your information, that is the Top Secret clearance that I have held for about 15 years as a commissioned officer in the US Coast Guard and more recently the NOAA.

Now you tell me this long garbled story about your security clearance is issued by the Australian Government “with the NSA and ASIO”, and then some total horseshit about a “(NATO) security clearance” but remind me that  “Australia is not even in NATO” LOL

Thing is, there is NO such thing as a NATO security clearance! LOL

Let me give this to you plain and simple: There is NO reciprocity between the US and Australia for security clearances. Each government is responsible for issuing its own clearances. Any request for reciprocity must be cleared through a Central Verification System (CVS) which is designated as the primary tool for facilitating reciprocal decisions, as required by Executive Orders, regulations and policies. This has to be done even between various US agencies, before accepting a clearance issued by another US agency. A clearance issued by another country undergoes much further scrutiny and may only be given what is known as a temporary facility secure clearance.

To hold “the highest security clearance that the US can give out” as you claimed, you need to be a US citizen and you are not. period

If you had said you held the highest security clearance that the Australian govt can give out, none of this would have happened. I do not owe you an apology for calling you out but I will accept your apology for making a misrepresentation.

 

 

 

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3 minutes ago, OceanBreeze said:

It is amazing how you just keep making up sh1t!

Your exact words were “I held the highest security clearance that the US can give out,

For your information, that is the Top Secret clearance that I have held for about 15 years as a commissioned officer in the US Coast Guard and more recently the NOAA.

Now you tell me this long garbled story about your security clearance is issued by the Australian Government “with the NSA and ASIO”, and then some total horseshit about a “(NATO) security clearance” but remind me that  “Australia is not even in NATO” LOL

Thing is, there is NO such thing as a NATO security clearance! LOL

Let me give this to you plain and simple: There is NO reciprocity between the US and Australia for security clearances. Each government is responsible for issuing its own clearances. Any request for reciprocity must be cleared through a Central Verification System (CVS) which is designated as the primary tool for facilitating reciprocal decisions, as required by Executive Orders, regulations and policies. This has to be done even between various US agencies, before accepting a clearance issued by another US agency. A clearance issued by another country undergoes much further scrutiny and may only be given what is known as a temporary facility secure clearance.

To hold “the highest security clearance that the US can give out” as you claimed, you need to be a US citizen and you are not. period

If you had said you held the highest security clearance that the Australian govt can give out, none of this would have happened. I do not owe you an apology for calling you out but I will accept your apology for making a misrepresentation.

 

 

 

So you hold a Top Secret security clearence, great, so did I, it's the same top secret, and as you know it is the highest level of security the US (or Australia) can give out.

So what is your problem again?

As you stated (that I stated) “I held the highest security clearance that the US can give out,

And I did, (and as far as I know, still do). 

I did hold the highest security clearance that the US can give out, which happens to be the highest security clearance Australia can give out, IT IS THE SAME CLEARANCE !!!

So are you being obtuse deliberately or what?

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No Shlt ! Who said there was, did I even say Australia was in NATO, again, it would be good if you actually made a point. 

I did say that the US and Australia have a very close alliance that includes security, we both have the SAME security models. That is why an Australian Security clearance, is the same clearance as a US security clearance. To the point where the equipment I dealt with (as you do), is made by the NSA.

You hold a TS clearance, and you do not understand that it is 'need to know' and Australia/US universal? I can't believe that. You must know that.

Possibly the US coast guard and NOAA does not work much with security allied countries, but your Navy certainly does. I've been in US battleships COMCEN's, I have had access to the keymats and the specifications and operation of US security systems. 

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There is NO reciprocity between the US and Australia for security clearances. Each government is responsible for issuing its own clearances. 

Right, but so what, that is not what I said of course, I never said that the US Government issued me a clearance. (why do you have so much trouble with that?). 

The Australian government issued me my clearance, my US equivalent clearance, just as valid in the US as it is in Australia. As I said, I was issued with the SAME LEVEL of security as the US can give out, happens to be the same level as Australia can give out.. Because it's the same clearance!

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That’s the sort of lie that can can cost you that Top Secret clearance that you don’t have.😤

It is not a lie, and also it is not something that could cost me that clearance (that you claim I do not have to begin with).

So if I don't have a clearance and lie that I do I could lose that clearance that I do not have?

Perhaps one day you can explain how that works.. LOL

OK a question for you, what would it take for me to lose my clearance, you should know this question as you claim you have to same clearance? 

What would you have to do to lose your clearance? 

 

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To hold “the highest security clearance that the US can give out” as you claimed, you need to be a US citizen and you are not. period

If you had said you held the highest security clearance that the Australian govt can give out, none of this would have happened. I do not owe you an apology for calling you out but I will accept your apology for making a misrepresentation.

For the first part, I have covered that several times now, and you even explained it yourself, so what do you not understand?

I held the highest level of security that the US can give out, that level was given to me by the Australian Government, but it is true, that it is the same level as the US, So my statement is true and correct. And as you said, you do not need to be a US citizen anyway, just need to know and background check..  

Do you not understand that?

The highest highest security clearance that Australia is the highest security clearance that the US can give out... IT'S THE SAME DAM clearance!

and you sure do owe me an apology, not that I expect to get one, you are way to arrogant to do that.

BTW: what level TOP SECRET do you hold? (do you even know what I am talking about?)

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32 minutes ago, Mutex said:

 

The Australian government issued me my clearance, my US equivalent clearance, just as valid in the US as it is in Australia. As I said, I was issued with the SAME LEVEL of security as the US can give out, happens to be the same level as Australia can give out.. Because it's the same clearance!

 

You should just stop now; you are making a fool out of yourself.

There are only three levels of clearances in the US: confidential, secret and top secret.

Australia has a different system with four levels of security clearances: baseline, NV1, NV2 and PV.

There is no such thing as a top secret clearance in Australia. The top secret designation is reserved for certain resources, not clearances.

If an Australian came to me and said he has a Top Secret clearance, I would know right away he was lying.

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1 hour ago, OceanBreeze said:

You should just stop now; you are making a fool out of yourself.

There are only three levels of clearances in the US: confidential, secret and top secret.

Australia has a different system with four levels of security clearances: baseline, NV1, NV2 and PV.

There is no such thing as a top secret clearance in Australia. The top secret designation is reserved for certain resources, not clearances.

If an Australian came to me and said he has a Top Secret clearance, I would know right away he was lying.

 

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You should just stop now; you are making a fool out of yourself.

There are only three levels of clearances in the US: confidential, secret and top secret.

Oh my  goodness, are you serious?  Yes, that is for the INFORMATION, that is their overall classification, however, for a personal security clearance like you and I have or had, the top secret has a number of specific levels, so my question was a bit of a test, someone with a TS security clearance would know what sublevel number they are.

But I am not going to give you information of how many levels there are and what other 'special modifiers" there can be, because you should already know that. 

So my clearance was Top Secret level X / Special Crypto. How many levels of X are there? and BTW my X value was the highest X value. 

Just look at your security pass, it should be right there, unless you do not have to wear a pass, but I doubt that you don't. 

So what TS level does your pass say you are? and what is the highest it can be?

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There are only three levels of clearances in the US: confidential, secret and top secret.

Australia has a different system with four levels of security clearances: baseline, NV1, NV2 and PV.

There is no such thing as a top secret clearance in Australia. The top secret designation is reserved for certain resources, not clearances.

DUDE, seriously!!! ??? Did you even go to and read that link?

How can you confuse two different things so badly? 

Baseline, NV1 ... are CLEARANCE LEVELS, I do NOT have a 'POSITIVE VETTING' security clearance!!

I have a Top Secret Special Crypto Level X Security clearance. To get that I reached the level of 'positive vetting' required to get that TS/SC clearance. 

DO you notice what it says after Positive Vetting ? "CLASSIFIED RESOURCES UP TO AND INCLUDING TOP SECRET"

I just don't know why you don't understand this: Seriously it's not that hard. It's ok to be wrong sometimes. But it would be better if you stopped digging yourself deeper.

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If an Australian came to me and said he has a Top Secret clearance, I would know right away he was lying.

That's astonishing! 

Yet you post a link to me that shows exactly that, does a PV cleared to Top Secret hold a Top Secret security clearance? IS he cleared to view (as necessary, need to know) classified information that is Top Secret.  

So how can an Australian no hold a Top Secret security clearance.  Or should they be cleared to "POSITIVE VETTING" !!! LOL.. 

Apology anytime you feel like it.

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11 minutes ago, montgomery said:

 

As for all the security clearances, we should be trying to sort out that baloney in the Lounge section.

Geeeeeezzzzz!

I agree with you Monty; I may move all of this security clearance tangent to its own thread later, but first I need to add just one more post.

In case anyone might be interested, (doubtful) here is an information sheet (pdf) that will tell you all you need to know about security clearances issued in Australia  by the Australian Government Security Vetting Agency (AGSVA):

Make special note of what the clearances are called. There is NO mention of a Top Secret clearance because there isn’t any such thing issued in Australia.

As a general indication, once AGSVA have received all the required information:

 a Baseline clearance may take approximately four weeks;

 a Negative Vetting 1 clearance may take approximately four months;

 a Negative Vetting 2 clearance may take approximately six months; and

 a Positive Vetting clearance may take in excess of six months.

Also, and I am sure Thoth can confirm this, the US DOD Common Access Card, CAC, (pdf) does not display the level of the holder’s security clearance. That information is on the military orders and retained by the security officer, SO on the base or ship where a person is assigned. Then it is up to the SO to issue facility access badges, if required, which are usually color coded to reflect level of access. I have seen Dept of Energy, DOE cards that do have a one-letter security designation on them, such as Q or L but not on DOD CAC cards.

Finally, the Top Secret clearance does not have levels; there is nothing higher than TS although there are different compartments such as SAP, SCI, and others but I am certainly not going to discuss what additional listings are on my TS.

 

 

 

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3 minutes ago, OceanBreeze said:

I agree with you Monty; I may move all of this security clearance tangent to its own thread later, but first I need to add just one more post.

 

 

 

 

I'm having trouble believing any moderator would pull that kind of a stunt to sooth his vainglorious needs!

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5 minutes ago, OceanBreeze said:

I agree with you Monty; I may move all of this security clearance tangent to its own thread later, but first I need to add just one more post.

In case anyone might be interested, (doubtful) here is an information sheet (pdf) that will tell you all you need to know about security clearances issued in Australia  by the Australian Government Security Vetting Agency (AGSVA):

Make special note of what the clearances are called. There is NO mention of a Top Secret clearance because there isn’t any such thing issued in Australia.

As a general indication, once AGSVA have received all the required information:

 a Baseline clearance may take approximately four weeks;

 a Negative Vetting 1 clearance may take approximately four months;

 a Negative Vetting 2 clearance may take approximately six months; and

 a Positive Vetting clearance may take in excess of six months.

Also, and I am sure Thoth can confirm this, the US DOD Common Access Card, CAC, (pdf) does not display the level of the holder’s security clearance. That information is on the military orders and retained by the security officer, SO on the base or ship where a person is assigned. Then it is up to the SO to issue facility access badges, if required, which are usually color coded to reflect level of access. I have seen Dept of Energy, DOE cards that do have a one-letter security designation on them, such as Q or L but not on DOD CAC cards.

Finally, the Top Secret clearance does not have levels; there is nothing higher than TS although there are different compartments such as SAP, SCI, and others but I am certainly not going to discuss what additional listings are on my TS.

 

 

 

Ok, I get it now, you seem to be unable to be contradicted, yes, there are levels and grades of security clearances. But clearly you do not work in a high security environment. 

You would know I have a Top Secret clearance and what level (1 to 6) and what special conditions by looking at my security pass, and seeing the number on it and the color of the bar behind my picture.

You will know I have clearance to be at that place because I AM there, I have access, the code, and the key card and security pass that is required.

I would NEVER have to tell you I had a Top Secret clearance, because if I did not I would not be there, and have a pass.

Working in a communications center in the Navy, you will see that everyone has a pass, they are all cleared to Top Secret, most with me TS level 4 and 5, but most of the techs will be TS level 6. If it is just a 6 and no special conditions, your picture on your pass that you have to wear at all times will have a blue background, My pass had a 6 (Top Secret level 6) and a yellow background, giving me the 'special crypto'.

But none of that even matters, If I did not have that level of clearance I would simply not have the keycard and code or permission to enter that area. 

Now I also understand that you can have a clearance such as Top Secret because some aspect of your job requires it, you might be a weapons operator and you might know top secret specifications of your system. You have no idea with 'number' you are, you do not require to display a pass and you do not require secure access. 

Totally different things, and conditions, and no that is not saying one is better than the other, just that it is not the same thing. 

And I don't think you get that. But this debate has become pointless.

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12 hours ago, OceanBreeze said:

I agree with you Monty; I may move all of this security clearance tangent to its own thread later, but first I need to add just one more post.

In case anyone might be interested, (doubtful) here is an information sheet (pdf) that will tell you all you need to know about security clearances issued in Australia  by the Australian Government Security Vetting Agency (AGSVA):

Make special note of what the clearances are called. There is NO mention of a Top Secret clearance because there isn’t any such thing issued in Australia.

As a general indication, once AGSVA have received all the required information:

 a Baseline clearance may take approximately four weeks;

 a Negative Vetting 1 clearance may take approximately four months;

 a Negative Vetting 2 clearance may take approximately six months; and

 a Positive Vetting clearance may take in excess of six months.

Also, and I am sure Thoth can confirm this, the US DOD Common Access Card, CAC, (pdf) does not display the level of the holder’s security clearance. That information is on the military orders and retained by the security officer, SO on the base or ship where a person is assigned. Then it is up to the SO to issue facility access badges, if required, which are usually color coded to reflect level of access. I have seen Dept of Energy, DOE cards that do have a one-letter security designation on them, such as Q or L but not on DOD CAC cards.

Finally, the Top Secret clearance does not have levels; there is nothing higher than TS although there are different compartments such as SAP, SCI, and others but I am certainly not going to discuss what additional listings are on my TS.

 

 

 

My last comment on this also. Yes this is true about the CAC card and I appreciate you for sharing. Also on a side note when I was in Iraq. There was NATO there and Aussies, Italians and many others from other countries. None of them were allowed any kind of access of anything secret. And the only way any of them were even allowed on a flightline they needed to be escorted. Even when the Aussies landed they had to be escorted everywhere and anyone and everyone who was not a citizen of the US. Same thing back at the home bases in the US.

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3 hours ago, Thoth101 said:

My last comment on this also. Yes this is true about the CAC card and I appreciate you for sharing. Also on a side note when I was in Iraq. There was NATO there and Aussies, Italians and many others from other countries. None of them were allowed any kind of access of anything secret. And the only way any of them were even allowed on a flightline they needed to be escorted. Even when the Aussies landed they had to be escorted everywhere and anyone and everyone who was not a citizen of the US. Same thing back at the home bases in the US.

From that pdf I see that a CAC is basically an ID card (quote: "A form of DoD ID card").

And again, sure everyone in the military is security cleared to some level, all this stuff about troops on the ground and NATO and Aussies not being allowed access to anything secret, is, well garbage.

It's also not the same thing.

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SO on the base or ship where a person is assigned. Then it is up to the SO to issue facility access badges, if required, which are usually color coded to reflect level of access.

Yes, now Ocean is talking about a security pass, as opposed to an ID card, and he does not (as I did) that they are color coded. 

When I served, the area I worked in was ALL Top Secret cleared, but within that building only specific people where allowed to be in specific places.

So although everyone had Top Secret clearance, WITHIN that level of clearance, there are 'grades' or sub levels, for example the color of your security pass, what your key card was able to open, and what combinations you were given.

So everyone had  Top Secret, but it was only those who had a yellow background, and a 6 in a big number over the card where allowed to enter the encryption sections of the facility. 

The office person working at the front desk, was cleared to Top Secret, but as they had no requirement to go into an operational area (like Crypto/Comms) they would have a TS security pass (top secret) a blue background and a big red 4 on their card. Their keycard would not open the door to places they could not go, and they where not given the access codes.

So Ocean you can repeat it all you like, it is clear you have never actually worked in a secure facility, but I have no doubt that in the course of your duties you may be required to view TS information, as such you have been cleared to top secret, but only in a very limited way. (in order for you to do your job). 

In signals and secure communications, you have have access to everything, as such to ensure only those required to have that access, have levels WITHIN the Top Secret security, and yes colors and numbers to designate where you are allowed to be and what you are allowed to view.

In fact as I stated before, I have Top Secret, yellow background, level 6 AND 'Special Crypto'.

On my security pass, that boils down to TS/SC 6 for Top Secret Special Crypto level 6. 

Here is a happy fact, I bet my A%% that you were not paid more than everyone else because you had access to some secret level stuff.

No one is paid more... except, the people who did my job (in communications and crypto), so if  you are TS cleared in an operations room and need to know the terminal velocity and range of a missile system. You are not paid more than anyone to keep your mouth shut.. 

But I was, I was also not allowed to travel to a number of specific countries until at least 5 years after any secure access, (it was possible to ask for an exemption). 

But it is a pointless conversation, you think I'm trying to say that I am better in some way by claiming a high clearance, to tell you the truth is was a pain in the A%%. Keycard, ID, card, Security pass, 5x 4 digit entry codes changed monthly. 

No wonder they paid us more, however, I will not accept being called a liar, from someone who clearly only has a passing experience to work in a highly secure environment. 

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6 minutes ago, Mutex said:

 

No wonder they paid us more, however, I will not accept being called a liar, from someone who clearly only has a passing experience to work in a highly secure environment. 

When you get caught in a lie you will most likely be called a liar and you should learn to accept it.

 

You said you had the highest level of security clearance given by the US.

 

The US does not give security clearances to non-US citizens.

 

You lied. That fact is obvious to everybody.

 

Now I will be moving all this crap out of this thread.

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59 minutes ago, OceanBreeze said:

When you get caught in a lie you will most likely be called a liar and you should learn to accept it.

 

You said you had the highest level of security clearance given by the US.

 

The US does not give security clearances to non-US citizens.

 

You lied. That fact is obvious to everybody.

 

Now I will be moving all this crap out of this thread.

Seriously, enough already, again you accuse me of lying, and it is your own freaking stupidity and arrogance that gets in your way. I DID NOT F---ing LIE.

So if you want me to get as nasty as you are, I will and of course you'll lose one more person who actually wants this site to continue and grow.

You (even as a mod) appear to want to burn it down, and drive everyone away.

So I will say this one more time, for the hard of understanding, I was issued and held and AUSTRALIAN issued Top Secret level 6 with special Crypto access, based on the US security model, where Top Secret is the highest level you can get and within that level there are grades or sublevels.

This level of security clearance is the highest the US gives out, and it is the highest Australia gives out, because THEY ARE THE SAME LEVEL of SECURITY. 

The US accepts the Australian issued Top Secret clearance, as valid because a hold of said clearance can work on systems and equipment classified BY THE US as top secret. So if the equipment I worked on made by the NSA IN THE US, and classified IN THE US as top secret, and ONLY those with top secret/special crypto can work on them, then IT IS a US security clearance, allowing me to work on secret equipment made by the NSA. 

NOW Ocean, what about that do you not understand? Or are you deliberately being obtuse to be an A$$hole? Because you're doing a great job at it.

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1 hour ago, Mutex said:

From that pdf I see that a CAC is basically an ID card (quote: "A form of DoD ID card").

And again, sure everyone in the military is security cleared to some level, all this stuff about troops on the ground and NATO and Aussies not being allowed access to anything secret, is, well garbage.

It's also not the same thing.

Yes, now Ocean is talking about a security pass, as opposed to an ID card, and he does not (as I did) that they are color coded. 

When I served, the area I worked in was ALL Top Secret cleared, but within that building only specific people where allowed to be in specific places.

So although everyone had Top Secret clearance, WITHIN that level of clearance, there are 'grades' or sub levels, for example the color of your security pass, what your key card was able to open, and what combinations you were given.

So everyone had  Top Secret, but it was only those who had a yellow background, and a 6 in a big number over the card where allowed to enter the encryption sections of the facility. 

The office person working at the front desk, was cleared to Top Secret, but as they had no requirement to go into an operational area (like Crypto/Comms) they would have a TS security pass (top secret) a blue background and a big red 4 on their card. Their keycard would not open the door to places they could not go, and they where not given the access codes.

So Ocean you can repeat it all you like, it is clear you have never actually worked in a secure facility, but I have no doubt that in the course of your duties you may be required to view TS information, as such you have been cleared to top secret, but only in a very limited way. (in order for you to do your job). 

In signals and secure communications, you have have access to everything, as such to ensure only those required to have that access, have levels WITHIN the Top Secret security, and yes colors and numbers to designate where you are allowed to be and what you are allowed to view.

In fact as I stated before, I have Top Secret, yellow background, level 6 AND 'Special Crypto'.

On my security pass, that boils down to TS/SC 6 for Top Secret Special Crypto level 6. 

Here is a happy fact, I bet my A%% that you were not paid more than everyone else because you had access to some secret level stuff.

No one is paid more... except, the people who did my job (in communications and crypto), so if  you are TS cleared in an operations room and need to know the terminal velocity and range of a missile system. You are not paid more than anyone to keep your mouth shut.. 

But I was, I was also not allowed to travel to a number of specific countries until at least 5 years after any secure access, (it was possible to ask for an exemption). 

But it is a pointless conversation, you think I'm trying to say that I am better in some way by claiming a high clearance, to tell you the truth is was a pain in the A%%. Keycard, ID, card, Security pass, 5x 4 digit entry codes changed monthly. 

No wonder they paid us more, however, I will not accept being called a liar, from someone who clearly only has a passing experience to work in a highly secure environment. 

If you worked with the US you would already know what a CAC is. From your statement you didn't seem to know what a CAC is. So that really does bring up to question your integrity. I can tell you from my own experience the British and Aussies were not allowed in any of our secret rooms. You can't even take a PED in the secret rooms. Although in Afghanistan we worked next to the British. But they had their own side and we had our own side. I did appreciate the British because they always had coffee made and we were welcome to go in their area and have some everyday. That is about as far as it went, sharing food and sharing coffee. I won't mention the British girls also.😄

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2 minutes ago, Thoth101 said:

If you worked with the US you would already know what a CAC is. From your statement you didn't seem to know what a CAC is. So that really does bring up to question your integrity. I can tell you from my own experience the British and Aussies were not allowed in any of our secret rooms. You can't even take a PED in the secret rooms. Although in Afghanistan we worked next to the British. But they had their own side and we had our own side. I did appreciate the British because they always had coffee made and we were welcome to go in their area and have some everyday. That is about as far as it went, sharing food and sharing coffee. I won't mention the British girls also.😄

I have worked with the US extensively, but I don't give a flying stuff what a CAC is, I don't care. So are you also implying I am lying? 

We'll your own experience is not much to go on, what did you do in the military, did you have access to secure areas? 

I have been in joint Naval exercises with the US military, and have worked on US war ships IN THEIR MOST SECURE area's, namely their communications and crypto rooms. 

So in MY experience, you're wrong. 

Of course you can't take a PED into those rooms, or a camera, hell in some places you are not even allowed to take notes, or write anything down at all. 

Anyway, this is a pointless and stupid conversation, and you guys are acting like flat earthers, if it looks flat to you, then it is flat. 

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It's up to you guys how you want this forum to progress or not, but accusing people of lying, and making stupid arguments and being arrogant Aholes, will not help you, perhaps the owner of the forum will try to do something to kick some life into the forum and promote some reasoned debate about science. 

But until that starts to happen I don't see how this forum is not just going to die. 

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On 10/7/2020 at 4:56 PM, Mutex said:

 

Possibly the US coast guard and NOAA does not work much with security allied countries, but your Navy certainly does. I've been in US battleships COMCEN's, I have had access to the keymats and the specifications and operation of US security systems. 

 

The Australian government issued me my clearance, my US equivalent clearance, just as valid in the US as it is in Australia. As I said, I was issued with the SAME LEVEL of security as the US can give out, happens to be the same level as Australia can give out.. Because it's the same clearance!

I

I missed a couple of these "Mutex's"

You were on US Battleships?  When was this? Oh, I know, you really didn't mean battleships just like you really didn't mean to say your TS clearance was given by the US, right?

As has been pointed out to you several times now, whatever security clearance you may have been given by the Australian authority, it is NOT valid at all in the US and it cannot be the same clearance, no matter how many times you assert it.

The US Coast Guard probably works far more with security allied countries and even non-allied countries, than the US Navy simply because the Coast Guard is a defensive organization, it is more readily accepted/trusted by other nations. That is also partially true of the NOAA since it is a scientific organization with many science partners from around the world.

 

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