Evolution is Junk Science and Secular Religion

[CD27]

ok, look, i notice that every single post i put up, you jsut absolutely have to send a rude comment back to me. it is getting quite aggrevating. is there any possible way that i can like press an ignore button to make it where you jsut can't post anything else to me? yea, light travels by years, but no one knows exactly where the center of the universe is. for all you know our galaxy could be the center, and if that's the case, then it doesn't matter how far away those stars are, because of the time dilation. those stars could really only be a couple thousand years olod, and because they are so far away, tehy would seem like billions of years old, so how does that make any difference? you know what, just don't even make a reply to this post. just leave me alone already.

[Tormod]

CD27, you are so arrogant I am amazed. I really recommend you find a different forum. You will not like it here unless you understand and accept this:

 

1) All your creationist ideas have been posted and discussed many, many times.

 

2) You need to accept that people respond to your posts. If you are offended, too bad. This is an open forum.

 

Tormod

[Tormod]

Originally posted by: Freethinker

Yes Tormod, we've had our share of ignorant Creationists come thru here. That wa what caught me here in the first place. Helping to teach them some reality. They all make their claims and either never show up again or soon find they did nlt actually have any FACTS behind them. And they sneak off into the night.

 

Do we play with this one for a while?

 

I don't know how long he will last, but he has at least been persistent with his double posting. Let's hope he gets his feet back on the ground or he'll tire out pretty soon.

 

And only 17...

 

Tormod

[Freethinker]

Originally posted by: CD27

ok, look, i notice that every single post i put up, you jsut absolutely have to send a rude comment back to me. it is getting quite aggrevating.

So being asked to PROVE your otherwise empty claims is causing you discomfort? My bad!

is there any possible way that i can like press an ignore button to make it where you jsut can't post anything else to me?

Ya, press the "Home" button on your browser. But if you are going to post here, you better be prepared to defend any claims you make. This is a SCIENCE site, not a religious rambling site.

yea, light travels by years, but no one knows exactly where the center of the universe is.

What does the center of the universe have to do with the speed of light?

 

The EARTH could be the center of the universe (a Christian concept still held today) and the speed of light would be the same. Do FACTS like this confuse you? Or just so completely destroy your claims that you don't WANT to understand it?

for all you know our galaxy could be the center, and if that's the case, then it doesn't matter how far away those stars are, because of the time dilation.

??? I don't know why I bother, you have yet to provide ANY facts for ANYTHING you have claimed so far, but I will ask anyway. Please show us all why one particular location being considered the center of the universe would change the speed of light and how "time dilation" would have ANYTHING to do with it.

those stars could really only be a couple thousand years olod, and because they are so far away, tehy would seem like billions of years old,

What is it about the speed of light that you find impossible to comprehend? Or again is it that it destroys your Christian nonsense so you refuse to acknowledge the reality of it?

 

if "they are so far away" (billions of light years), their light is going to take billions of years for their light to get here NO MATTER WHAT. No matter where a center is, no matter when they or the universe came into existence. If the universe is 6,000 years old, you would only see stars closer than 6,000 light years away. All 4 of them! LOL!

so how does that make any difference?

EXACTLY my question.

you know what, just don't even make a reply to this post. just leave me alone already.

Awe, am I already causing too much cognitive dissonance? Too many of those questions you can't answer? Too many FACTS destroying your mythical world?

 

Welcome to my world.

[Frogon]

While I was talking with someone they gave me this site to go to:

 

http://www.godsaidmansaid.com/

 

Its quite interesting, as they say "is carbon dating the work of the devil?" honestly how can you not laugh... Just some more fun for you freethinker, lol

[Freethinker]

Originally posted by: Frogon

Just some more fun for you freethinker, lol

Hey, thanks for thinking of me. I loved the flash opening! Amazing how they take advantage of technology based on science they so ademantly reject!

 

But such logic would only confuse them more...

 

Ya, quite a site. It's truly amazing that anyone can actually believe this stuff in the 21st Century.

[Frogon]

lol, you think thats ironic:

 

If you find someone who attempts to prove their old age position, they will typically march out flawed circular reasoning or dating systems built up upon unprovable assumptions.

 

Just the "unprovalbe assumptions" part...man I don't know if they are talking about the bible, or trying to insult science..

[Freethinker]

Originally posted by: Frogon

or trying to insult science..

They insult science by even pretending to try to use it.

[CD27]

freethinker, i am actually quite amazed of the time you spend when you reply to my posts. oh well, your waste. yes, i am only 17, that changes nothing other than the fact that i am younger than most people. the only reason i "double posted" was because i posted my theory inside a post. that would leave the theory nearly hidden, unless you went into that particular post. so i put it in its own seperate post, so that it is more visible.

[Tormod]

Originally posted by: CD27

freethinker, i am actually quite amazed of the time you spend when you reply to my posts. oh well, your waste.

 

Stop and think for a minute. Freethinker took time to reply to your posts. My guess: it was because he felt that he had something to say about it and wanted to be thorough about his reply. Wouldn't it be better to try to follow up his replies rather than talking him down?

 

Tormod

[Freethinker]

Originally posted by: CD27

freethinker, i am actually quite amazed of the time you spend when you reply to my posts. oh well, your waste. yes, i am only 17,

I never waste my time. I enjoy life no matter what I am doing. Or try to. The only thing that could be a waste regarding my post is your wasting the benefit you could derive by reading it. You admit to being "only 17". You are in or coming into the age that most brilliant minds were most productive in. You are intensely questioning, but you do not present your ideas in a fashion that would show a logic based argument.

 

I have taken individual parts of your presentation and applied Critical Thinking and Scientific Rigor to them. Such as:

 

 

yea, light travels by years, but no one knows exactly where the center of the universe is.

 

 

What does the center of the universe have to do with the speed of light?

Do you have an answer? Can't you see the hole in your argument because of it?

 

Perhaps my biggest regret about my younger years was having gone to a religious school. While they stuffed a lot of FACTS into my head, I could pass knowledge tests very well, they did not teach HOW to think. Religion has an inherent bias AGAINST skepticism. Especially formally structured critical thinking.

"Credo quia absurdum est"- "I believe because it's absurd" Tertullian (2nd century church father)

 

"We ought always be ready to believe that what seems to us white is black if the hierarchical church so defines it" Ignatius Loyola (founder of the Jesuits)

 

"If you accept the literal truth of every word of the Bible, then the earth must be flat. The same is true for the Qu'ran. Pronouncing the earth round then means you're an atheist. Anyone of the round persuasion does not believe in God and should be punished." [Muslim religious edict, 1993 Sheik Abdel-Aziz Ibn Baaz Supreme religious authority, Saudi Arabia]

 

YOU want to draw a line in your desire to critically review things.

i did not ask or even want someone who is not in correspondance to the spiritual dimensions, even descretely, to even try to read this theory. so from now on, anyone who looks at it in the view of being wrong because of religion, i will simply ignore.

It is not too late for you. You can break thru the ignornace of an arbitrarly line in the sand. You can openly evaluate, and invite open critical evauation of all your held beliefs. You can decide to learn HOW to think.

 

Or you can ignore me because I disagree with you.

 

But that is not MY waste of time.

[CD27]

tormod, you are right, i should respect the fact that he even did reply to my post at all.

 

freethinker, now that i have taken tormor's advice, i can actually see what you mean by your posts. i admit, in alot of christian schools and churches the preacher's have a very abd understanding of christianity. they are afraid of society throwing them away, because they are afraid of losing souls. you must notice though, we as christians believe that al of this is true, and that it is a narrow path. i belive the bible solely, but i do not even care about catholics, they contradict the bible every single day. and so do alot of ather protestant churches as well. i fortunately have a rather good churche. my preacher follows the bible greatly, and he is a very good man. an upstanding man in both religion and in society. he puts both together and yet is still able to live well in society and follow our god's laws just as greatly. there are many christians who say they are christians, then go home and lok up porn on their computers, or go and smoke a cigarrett to release "stress". they go home and beat their wives and yell at their children. they kill themselves. they kill others. those are not real christians. those are hypocrytes. if i have offended anyone by posting my theory, i appologize. i am "only 17", but my religion is what it is, i can see what the world has made of it, and what the bible has made of it. peopel tell me al the time, "christianity is so narrow, how do they ever have any fun? they're jsut robots for their 'god'" christians can have fun without lusting, without smoking, without hurting other people. long before STD's came out, the bible said not to have sex with more than one partner your entire life. it has been proven thruogh many years research that everyone has STD's, but until they have sex with more than one person the STD's they have are dormant. once you ahve sex with more than one person, they become active, to whatever std's the other partner's you have slept with have as well. and ust think about it, if you have sex with one person, who had sex with two people, who each had sex with four people, who each had sex with three people, etc. that's alot of people. and if you think about it, you just, indirectly, had sex with all of them. if you read, in the bible, not by what a preacher says, you will have the correct answers. but it is also the way you read it, this is old english you're dealing with. hard to comprehend correctly. it gives life's answer before they are questioned. the bible says to not harm yourself or anyone else. it says to turn the other cheek, but then it also says to defend yourself. those two contradict each otehr right? no. when a simple error is made and it is possible to get out of it, simply turn the other cheek and walk away, but if you are in imediate danger, and there is no other way out of it, defend yourself and your family. now, with when god told the jews to kick those people out jerusalem, it was the jew's land to begin with. those people stole it from them. so god helped them tog et their rightful belonging land back. the bible isn't wrong, what is wrong is what the peole for long many years have said about it. like i said, it depends on how you lok at it. as notified about the turning the other cheek and then defending yourself. at first it seemed to contradict each other, but when looked at a diferent way, it worked perfectly. even though i am a christian, that does not mean i can not be a scientist at the same time. i love my religion, and i love my science, but i love my religion more. i mix the two together, i know,a nd that makes alot of arguments arise, but i lok for the truth in what my bible says and what my sicence says, not what any preacher says or what you say. if you are a scientific person and want to help me scientifically, i will take that help greatly, but i ask of you, please do not trash down my religion. and if you are a religious person and wish to help me with my religion, i accept that as well. for me, my religion has no possibility of bein

[Tormod]

"for me, my religion has no possibility of being wrong, that's just what i belive, but science always has a possibility of being wrong"

 

See, this is where you are only 17 and need to open up your mind a bit. You come forth as a fundamentalist.

 

"Science" does not have a tendency to be wrong. "Science" is not one single thing. It is a process in which people learn about how things work by studying them, using scientific methods. Their methods, theories, assumptions, results may be wrong, but not "science". Do you see what I'm trying to say? Scientists may be wrong, too.

 

But blindly believing that *your* religion is the one and only truth - well, that is about as wrong as it gets in my eyes. You say you are not lead by anyone but live by the book. Then how did you form your opinion about things? Have you ever questioned the teachings of your bible? If the answer is no - well, then I'm sorry for you. And I do NOT mean that in an offensive way.

 

And may I please ask you one more time to hit the ENTER key on your keyboard a bit more often to make your text slightly more readable.

 

With regards,

Tormod

[CD27]

tormor,

 

yes, i have questioned my religion, many times actually. i always come up with the same conclusion, that it must be right. in fact, i even spent a few years trying to disprove my religion, before it was something that i lived by.

 

i can not see a universe being able to exist without a creator. for something be created, to even have a begining, it must have a creator. from that conlusion comes the question, "if god created everything, how was god created?" i have a theory on that as well, or a "hypothesis". here it is:

 

god created himself. just as the solution to everyhting else this religion. it is a complicated conclusion, and takes deep thought to understand fully. i will try to explain it. god is outside of time. god created time, so wouldn't it be logic thought that he can control it at his own will? if god went back through time, to his "beginning", he could create himself. in other words, god always existed. it is quite complicated.

 

the reason i belive my religion is "absolutely right" and can not be wrong, is because it tells me that. as i said before, i belive everything in teh bible is true to its word, and if it tells me it is the only true religion, then, yea, i belive that as well.

[Tim_Lou]

hmm...

CD27, whats the reason you believe in christians?

is it because it provides you strength in life? or have an experence involving with god? or?

 

 

anyway, asking "how was god created?" is similar to "how everything is created in the world"

these answers are unanswerable and unquestionable.

 

god and the "thing" where everything comes from doesnt exist, b4 them, there is no existence and such...

the way we think, is limited, so its just too abstract to even have an idea of what "they" are...since we are in this "real" world, and we think in a "real" way.

[TeleMad]

CD27: ... i belive everything in teh bible is true to its word ...

 

So you believe in the story of Noah's Ark...that it literally happened as described in the Bible?

 

 

 

 

 

So you believe the Earth is only about 6,000 years old?

 

 

 

 

 

What happened to those "righteous, God-fearing individuals" that died before Jesus was crucified? Did they go to heaven? Can you provide a quote to support whatever position you hold?

 

 

 

 

 

Can person be "saved" and then "lost"? Is there any self-contradiction about this in the Bible?

[CD27]

yes, i believe all of that about noah's ark, the earth being 6,00 years old, all of that. if you are saved, and then lost, then you were never saved in the first place. you may have thought you were, but if, in the very end, your name is not written in the book of life, then you were never saved. and the people who killed jesus, if they asked him for his forgiveness, and truely meant it, then yes, they could have went to heaven, provided they recieved jesus christ as their personal savior.

 

the reason i believe in god (not the christians) is because of a personal experience with god. and yes, it is personal, so don't ask.