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Perfecting Perpetual Wheel


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yes! i was looking into power springs that are constant motion and most require a battery. But that would defeat the purpose wouldn't it, so I felt the solution would be something that holds a charge.

 

A capacitor holds a charge. Like a battery, it induces electric current. But, it is depleted just like a battery. It would have to be recharged to keep going. If you use the spring to power a generator which makes electrical power to charge the capacitor and you include friction as a factor, then you cannot make as much energy with the generator than what is needed to charge the capacitor according to the laws of thermodynamics. So, there can certainly be none left over to use for anything else.

 

Do you think its laughable or doable :huh:

 

I don't think it's laughable because it is a common question, not only here at scienceforums, but a common question people ask themselves. I know many people, and I myself, have considered some kind of perpetual motion machine some time in their life. I don't, however, think it is doable. The laws of thermodynamics are just too well supported. I wouldn't bet against them.

 

I would say that the chances a perpetual motion machine be created is the same as the likelihood an anti-gravity device which causes things to fall upward off planet earth be created.

 

~modest

 

EDIT: By "perpetual motion machine" I should say explicitly that I mean a machine that not only turns perpetually, but that creates useful power for other things. That would violate both the first and the second law of thermodynamics. Something that just turns perpetually with no fiction would be only an exception to the second law.

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Well I was hoping that the power spring which will run with very little current to start it off would be easily recharged by a battery that holds a charge and can be recharged by the turbine. You could wind it up and use no battery but than you would have to find some way to do that to keep up with the spring release.

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Well I was hoping that the power spring which will run with very little current to start it off would be easily recharged by a battery that holds a charge and can be recharged by the turbine. You could wind it up and use no battery but than you would have to find some way to do that to keep up with the spring release.

 

But I now see your point. For the amount of mechanic energy require to sustain this power spring which operates on energy it would drain the energy created.

 

Back to the drawing board on clocks and pullys. :huh:

post-18251-024634800 1283552359_thumb.jpg

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Welcome to hypography, hummingbird! :huh:

 

If you’re looking for a useful power-generating system – as opposed to interested in reading about the often fascinating world of pseudoscience and chicanery – it would be a disservice to encourage you to do any research into perpetual motion machines of any kind.

 

Although one can find countless pamphlets, books, and websites promoting or even selling them or plans to them, no such device has every supplied useful power to anyone. People who promote them are either honest but poorly educated in science and engineering, mentally ill, frauds (many of whom seek to defraud the unwary of money), or the unwary who have been duped into assisting in fraud. Very bad karma! :(

 

To go “off-grid” – generate you own electricity – you must buy/lease and/or build a generator that actually works, following legitimate scientific and engineering principles and standards. Unfortunately, such systems are rarely inexpensive (which makes sense, because if they were, few people would purchase electrical power rather than simply buying such a generator).

 

You mention that where you want electricity – western Washington state – is not a good site for solar or wind power. That leaves only a couple of obvious free sources you could use for a generator – geothermal (eg: hot springs) or water (a fairly large stream fairly high above where you can place your generator). Either approach will require a fair amount of engineering, work, and money, but if feasible, will actually work. If not feasible, you may need to either move somewhere with a feasible free power source, or resign yourself to buying electricity from a power company, as I assume you are now.

 

I'm very glad came here. This post has been very helpful and sorry for being so slow. I'm glad for your patience. :)

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BTW, Newton's First Law of Motion, "every object in a state of uniform motion tends to remain in that state of motion unless an external force is applied to it.", actually means that all motion is perpetual without external forces applied to it. Once you include the friction of tapping the energy of that motion you have applied an external force and that motion will no longer tend to remain in its previous state.

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Waste Management has done some really cool things, changes to help our environment. I was hoping to tap into waste as an alternative energy by means of biogas, but it still effects the green house.

 

 

There is no reason not to use waste bio-gas, it is methane and it escapes from waste dumps whether you tap into it or not. Using it to produce usable energy does not increase it's greenhouse gas potential. All you do is turn methane into CO2 and use that energy instead of the methane turning into CO2 on it's own and wasting that energy...

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Waste Management has started a new project of helping breaking down waste. I wonder why they don't just see all the valuable energy source and work to use it for energy?

 

So are you wanting to use nuclear waste as energy or just go nuclear energy? I almost went on the Hanford walk when they started to sell their waste recently. What's your thoughts on it?

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Waste Management has started a new project of helping breaking down waste. I wonder why they don't just see all the valuable energy source and work to use it for energy?

 

So are you wanting to use nuclear waste as energy or just go nuclear energy? I almost went on the Hanford walk when they started to sell their waste recently. What's your thoughts on it?

 

 

Both, what we now call nuclear waste is really just fuel for the new generation nuclear reactors.

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I think the original idea was to find a way to recycle the energy to re-power the device using the energy. This idea has been played with on superconductors, but the problem is, you always tend to lose some energy, if not most of it, when you recycle it. The energy can transfer from state to state, but you can't make all of it transfer back, as they differentiate.

 

You mentioned something about space travel. Reabsorbing energy off a superconductor would help, but there wouldn't be enough, so solar panels would be the alternative for gaining power back. Heat transference can actually be solved by running liquid nitrogen around the conductor and then back around the outside of the craft, using the coldness of space itself to cool the liquid back down. There are ways to take energy back from the environment even if they aren't perfect.

 

No matter how close to perfection we get, there will never be perfection itself. We have to learn to utilize the many, many tools around us in the most effective way to bring about harmony.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Could you explain how stopping having fanciful ideas would lead to our extinction?

 

I'll attempt a try.

 

Fanciful ideas once upon a time, include moving pictures in a box, putting a man in the moon and ipod nanos.

Moving even further back, fanciful ideas may mean gas stoves, canned food and any other convenience we take for granted today.

Waaaaaaay back , fanciful ideas would mean any sort of technology however primitive they may appear to us today,

Humans will not last very long, if they have to hunt for food with their bare hands and then eat it raw. (Fire is a technology)

back to the present. Fanciful ideas today are like technology to shake off our dependence on oil. Even if it means even more kinds of perpetual machines, so be it. We have to realize that some ideas will lead to fruitation and others are just complete waste of money, time and brains.

Anyway life's not worth living if its not fun.

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  • 2 weeks later...

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