Zimbabwe...

[gribbon]

Originally posted by Boerseun If you think Zim is so great...

 

I don't think I need to say anything - Boerseun is simply showing his inability to read again.

 

...it seems you've got a bit of a flair for the inappropriately dramatic, too. If you had any idea as to what the metaphor meant, you would know that you have used it in totally and completely the wrong context

.

 

and...

 

The happenings in Zim might be far worse that (sic) enslavement - slaves, at least, get fed every now and then.

 

At least my grammar is accurate. Besides, I've always liked drama. :cup:

 

As for believing that slavery is better than extreme poverty, I'll allow you the opportunity to reconsider your words. Doubtless, you will choose to repeat the asinine belief that slavery is better than poverty. Go for it.

 

Oh - and something which interests me more. Something which I have heard far worse things about from Red Cross and Amnesty International workers. I'll give you a little hint.

 

Genocide in Darfur.

 

Are you going to accept that this is a more significant issue, or would you rather resolve issues that permit you to bask in the glare of the media? (Oh, I'm being "drammatic" again, better stop!)

 

Try hiding your "charisma", and actually recognise what is worse. You are not some heroic "knight in shining armour".

[InfiniteNow]

You're off your meds again, aren't you?

[Qfwfq]

Gribbon, quit being annoying.

 

Boerseun keeps telling you that you are totally missing the point of his thread, either keep on topic or post elsewhere. I agree that there are troubles in other countries, I even agree that slavery has some worse aspects than hunger alone, but that simply and plainly isn't the point. This thread is about Zimbabwe.

[Racoon]

Honestly, I don't know much about Zimbabwe. Other than its another African country deep in the forests of Africa.. or what was once forests :)

 

But my impressions of Mozambique are bad... :hyper:

 

Are they related??

 

Is Zimbabwe following in the footsteps of a corrupt gang-like dictatorship?

[eric l]

Honestly, I don't know much about Zimbabwe. Other than its another African country deep in the forests of Africa.. or what was once forests :doh:

 

But my impressions of Mozambique are bad... :evil:

 

Are they related??

 

Is Zimbabwe following in the footsteps of a corrupt gang-like dictatorship?

 

Problem is that apparently very few people know much about Zimbabwe and what is really going on there. (Mozambique by the way is a neighbouring country; in colonial times it was Portuguese while Zimbabwe - then Rhodesia - was British and remained a bit British-colony-like as an "independent" country under Ian Smith (1965 - 1980))

 

I know quite some people in NGO's (non governmental organisations) that are active in Africa, but pretty few are active in Zmbabwe. Rather than getting their information from people in the field, they too have to depend on "reliable sources".

 

The European press is also very absent. In fact, that is true for the whole of "black" Africa. I can not prove it with exact and up to date numbers, but there must be fewer European journalists present in the whole of black Africa than in Israel and Palestine.

 

Add to this that Zimbabwe has no coastline, so there are hardly any holiday resorts for the whealty Europeans and/or Americans...

[Boerseun]

All true, Eric.

 

The newest idiocy by Mugabe is to threaten all companies that price hikes are illegal. Any company putting up prices will be seized and ownership will be given to native Zimbabweans (read: Mugabe's buddies). Obviously, this is a ruse to keep his buddies on his side, because faced with inflation of over 5000% (as at today), it's simply impossible to freeze prices. Consumer goods' prices double more than twice a week - my source is the Rapport newspaper, an Afrikaans paper which won't mean much to you English-speakers out there. I'll look for some English sources.

 

My brother-in-law went for some team-building session in Zim a few weeks ago, and he said that the tourists are having a roaring time (obviously - seeing as things are dirt cheap when paying in South African Rands, US dollars or pounds). Zimbabweans caught with foreign currency face stiff jail sentences. But there's no other way for them to buy anything at all at the shops unless they do it in foreign currency. The whole setup is a farce.

 

Watch this space - Zimbabwe is about to collapse utterly and completely. And it has nothing to do with anything but a power-hungry fool. Zimbabwe used to be one of the shining beacons of hope in Africa, and used to be a nett food exporter up till about eight years ago. Now, they're dependent on foreign aid. How sad is that? I think the last time the World has seen hyperinflation to such a scale, was in 1920's Germany, where a few billion Deutchmarks bought you a loaf of bread. We're heading that way with Zim now, as we speak.

 

Me and a few friends have actually banded together to buy around a thousand Rand's worth of Zim dollars. So that the next time we play blackjack at home, or even monopoly, we've got some genuine currency to play with, to the tune of a couple o' million dollars' worth! Imagine - each guy sitting around the blackjack or poker table will have a huge pile of actual currency in front of him! Forget about playing with coins - we're gonna play with $1,000 notes! (Just don't tell anyone that the 5c pieces we used to play with are actually worth more than the $1,000 notes! - and also, ignore the expiry dates on them! ;) )

[gribbon]

The governent needs to re-institute reasonable price controls and protection on the countries industries, which, by the standards of Sub-Saharan Africa are quite diverse because of sanctions in the 1970's. The mining industry should also be able to rebound being as there are a fair number of metallic and non-metallic ores.

 

The ludicrous inflation figures could also be brought down quite significantly if the black market exchange could be stopped.

 

As for the food problems, one thing that would temporarily help whilst the land reform damage is undone, would be for the UNWFP to reintroduce supplies, so then at least the governement could stop having the borrow from elsewhere.

[Chacmool]

As for the food problems, one thing that would temporarily help whilst the land reform damage is undone, would be for the UNWFP to reintroduce supplies, so then at least the governement could stop having the borrow from elsewhere.

Good Ol' Bob Mugabe usually dishes out any poverty relief in the form of food to his buddies. People from the opposition can forget about getting ANY of it.

 

The situation in Zimbabwe is really dire, and I applaude Boerseun for trying to draw some attention to it. Just because the country isn't rich in oil or doesn't have sandy beaches doesn't mean that the people suffering there shouldn't matter to all of us.

[InfiniteNow]

Good Ol' Bob Mugabe usually dishes out any poverty relief in the form of food to his buddies. People from the opposition can forget about getting ANY of it.

 

Interesting point, Chacmool. External aid is great in theory, but if it never reaches it's intended recipients it becomes a moot issue altogether.

[DougF]

I must admit to not knowing anything about the situation in Zimbabwe. I don't even think I could point it out on a map, let alone discuss its leader. :hihi:

To tell you the Truth I'm in the boat with Freeztar,

is there a good place to go to rectify this?

[DougF]

I found a couple of links.

 

News24.com: Africa: Breaking News: Africa, Features, News, Zimbabwe

 

Zimbabwe is a sore thumb for the African continent which last year enjoyed an average economic growth of around 4.5% and single digit inflation rates

IMF: Zim is Africa's sore thumb: Africa: Zimbabwe: News24

"I don't think that they (Zimbabwe authorities) can avoid collapse, given where they are now, given the lack of taste for embracing any reforms, given also the depth of the kind of reform that will be needed, and the time for recovery," the official told AFP.

His prediction was of a "total collapse" of what he called "a basket case for all the region".

He slammed fellow African leaders for failing to put the Zimbabwe crisis on the summit agenda.

 

 

I must be living a bubble, I wish we could just get along.

if we stopped making bombs there would be monies too feed the world.:hihi:

[Boerseun]

Funnily enough, we've got our load of Zim dollars today.

 

My friend went through on his business trip, and had to cash in Rands for Zim dollars at the border on his way there, just to get the stamp on his passport. You have to go through and change R1000 for around Z$5,000 (on the official exchange rate). Once through, your Z$5,000 will buy you maybe a third of a beer. Keep in mind that you just paid R1,000 for a third of a beer. A R1,000 will normally buy you at least 300 beers in SA. So, after having been through the bullcrap border requirements, the locals come running up to you with local currency that they change at the "blackmarket" rate. Note that this is only called "blackmarket" because the government doesn't control it. But money being money, the actual worth is determined by the people. If everybody loses trust in your currency, it means doodley-squat, regardless of what the government says. The value of money is determined by public trust.

 

So - the "blackmarket" money-changers came up to him, and we got more than Z$5million for our collective thousand-Rand effort. A thousand Rands constitutes ten notes, a pile about two millimeters thick if new and crisp. For our effort we got back two black dustbin-bags of currency. I feel heartbroken about how a beautiful and prosperous country like Zimbabwe was reduced to dust by one single powerhungry fool. But now I'm gonna play poker with my mates, where the minimum stakes are $10,000. Zim $'s, however.

[Boerseun]

According to News24, Mugabe has decided now to empty the cities, and control the rural areas through food aid. The rural areas have historically been ZANU-PF strongholds, whilst the cities have been MDC (the official opposition) areas. So, in preparation for next year's presidential "elections", Mugabe is emptying the cities so that the MDC will loose parliament seats.

 

He went so far as to stop food aid to the cities, because there are "shops from where food can be bought", but after enforcing rigourous price control, the vast majority of shops have closed down, making it impossible for city dwellers to find any food. He also employed a Canadian PR-company to spin the image of a happy, peaceful and prosperous rural Zimbabwe to the world. Obviously not showing the hunger and strife in the cities. I would love to know how the people at that particular Canadian company sleep at night.

 

He's desperately holding on to power for fear of repercussions should he step down, in the form of the International Court of Justice calling him to answer for the last few years' excesses. He's trying to cover his own butt, and to hell with the rest. You have never in your life seen such a pathetic crazy fool such as this. Just a pity that millions are suffering due to his stupidity.

[freeztar]

"No more internal power struggle

We come together to overcome the little trouble

Soon we'll find out who is the real revolutionary

Cause I don't want my people to be contrary

And brother you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're soooo right

We'll have to fight...we gonna fight...we'll have to fight...fight for our rights

...

To divide and rule, could only tear us apart

In every man's chest, there beats a heart

So soon we'll find out who is the real revolutionaries

And I don't want my people to be tricked by mercenaries"

-Bob Marley

 

Bob would be saddened by the present state of things. :hihi:

[Buffy]

According to News24, Mugabe has decided now to empty the cities, and control the rural areas through food aid.

 

Separated at birth?

 

 

The Shadow knows, :evil:

Buffy

[Chacmool]

The life expectancy of the average person in Zimbabwe has dropped to a mere 30 years. The country is battling with high rates of HIV and TB infections, yet most people don't have access to adequate health care.

[Boerseun]

This is indeed a tragedy in our times. And, infuriatingly enough, political correctness and debts being paid by so-called liberators to their former sponsors makes the region impotent to do anything about this.

 

And the entire world simply couldn't be bothered by the happenings in a minute speck on the global economic map. Not that it's their responsibility, mind you. But a complete and total economic implosion such as this, which was also completely and totally preventable, will be a pitch black mark against the Southern African community of nations for many, many years to come.

 

Also, according to the BBC, out of Zimbabwe's 16,000,000 citizens, there are about 10,000,000 left in the borders of Zim. There vast majority of the missing 6,000,000 are now residing within the borders of South Africa, where local businesses are exploiting them because they're willing to work below minimum wage. They have to live below the radar in order to escape the authorities and deportation back to Zim, which means they have no recourse to labour protection, etc. And they're not here because they want more money (which is understandable in terms of normal cross-border migrations), they're here because they simply want something to eat.

 

The South Africans aren't too happy about being flooded by out-of-work illegal immigrants, because they are taking up bottom-of-the-rung job opportunities. Violence against illegal immigrants (specifically against Mozambicans and Zimbabweans) is on the increase, which might be an understandable reaction by the unemployed masses against those taking scarce jobs away from them. Yet they stream across the borders.

 

So what, you might ask. Well, South Africa simply cannot absorb the rest of Africa's poor. At a stage, South Africa will collapse, too.

 

I'm infuriated at the situation in Zimbabwe, and at the fact that there's absolutely zip I can do about it.

 

President Thabo Mbeki of South Africa is simply too spineless to reprimand his neighbour to the North, because in the apartheid days, Zimbabwe was a springboard for military activity against the Pretoria government, and those old debts are now to be repaid. In other words, look away whilst Mugabe totally rapes a former strong and beautiful country to his heart's content.

 

I am angry.