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AnssiH last won the day on July 21 2020

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  1. Hi Sluggo, Now that you mention this, the original paper for SR (that I linked before) is actually quite nice in that it doesn't really suggest any particular ontology (like Minkowski spacetime), but the reader must be careful to understand it as merely drawing purely logical connections between definitions when reading it. Nowadays people read it with Minkowski's interpretation in mind and tend to take SR as literally an argument for "Minkowski spacetime", even though it doesn't mention such thing anywhere. This misconception leads exactly into my original complaint about people locki
  2. Hi Sluggo I'm afraid your post exemplifies exactly the confusions I was complaining about in my long post. Look, it's very simple to convince yourself of this matter. The mathematics of Lorentz aether theory are exactly the same as using Special Relativity, but instead of transforming from observer to observer, you'd arbitrarily choose some reference frame, and then do all of your calculations from that frame. I'm sure you can trivially accept this as mathematically valid approach. You can always go back to this simple point, if you feel any doubt. If the above wouldn't work, th
  3. Hmm yes, that could make it easier to follow... 🤔 OTOH I'm also on the fence for completely removing all the extra commentary as it's not strictly needed... but then I also feel like some readers might be stuck on one of those solutions, and unable to see its problems without pointing it out... Anyway, good feedback, I'll need to think about what to do... Thanks! -Anssi
  4. Let me say I completely share the sentiment in the OP. Especially in popularizations of science, the language used is almost always using much more certain terms than is actually warranted, and I think it is damaging to the students of science. And it is not just the language used, often the people teaching the topics are confusing apples with oranges themselves. "Scientific philosophy" (a.k.a. "science") originally arose as a response against the unwarranted air of certainty of various religious philosophies. It is, or at least should be, by its very definition, the attitude of preservin
  5. Alright,I gave this a stab. Here's what I have so far; https://www.dropbox.com/s/p4msczv4028rd8i/Kinematic Solution To The Ehrenfest Paradox.pdf?dl=0 I'm failing on the "concise" part a bit, although more than half of the length is extra discussion. I feel like this whole thing could be explained in one page, but then I look at all the silly solution suggestions out there in published papers, and my confidence to the "one-page approach" being enough vanishes... I just don't know which detail is the one everyone keep missing here when they insist on paradoxical solutions 🤷‍♂️ Anyway
  6. So, going back to the topic of the OP, it seems to me that it would make sense to publish this solution somewhere. I mean we have over a century of silly solutions, so maybe it's time... There must be people out there who'd be interested of understanding how it actually pans out under SR. I'm absolutely confident this is correct solution because it just falls out of purely SR logic without violating anything in SR. I could write a cleaned up, clearer, more concise / focused version. Maybe add a clarifying picture or two if it feels necessary. (Any feedback for anything that felt unclear in th
  7. Yeah I noticed the comments about this when reading that thread on the other forum. Seems kind of strange to assume that beyond our observational boundary nothing would influence things inside our boundary... But throughout the history of natural philosophy we have found - to the surprise of most people - that we are further and further away from the center of the universe. And step by step we have found that we are smaller than we think. Again this really says more about the human psychology than the universe... And on that token, the common Big Bang view just really does place us in a re
  8. That's quite interesting. This is a topic I'm not too familiar with so I can't say much. But I noticed people quite aggressively defending "conventional views" on that other forum. I must say that in general the whole general topic of dark matter, dark energy, big bang theory etc, is so full of shaky assumptions, crude approximations and dependencies to rather fragile aspects of our current theories, that I find little bit silly to take any of it as much more than highly hypothetical musings. I mean, it's hard to think of a more arrogant thing to say than "we know the age of the universe" or
  9. I'm not familiar with Penrose's argument on this matter, but I touched the topic of people trying to solve the paradox with additional dynamics, and why that is immediately off-topic. Of course there are no "rigid bodies" because there's no infinite information speeds holding objects together. But the point of the paradox is to question how does purely abstract geometry work in terms of relativistic transformation. A single inertial frame is expressed in euclidean coordinate system by definition, therefore a snapshot of a disk must also be expressible as euclidean no matter what inertial fra
  10. Yeah I would pretty much agree with that. It's a bit unfortunate that it's so popular to see these concepts as something much more than very handy mental ideas.
  11. Yeah I would consider that one of the better representations of the issue, because it draws out the fact that the whole thing arises from the notion of dynamic simultaneity. And note how he represents objects as a set of spatial/temporal events to make the actual logical mechanism clear - exactly what I'm talking about in my previous long post. Another thing that his apparatus also makes very clear is that the frame transformation really does just scale events around - there is no way to end up into a self-contradiction even if you are transforming events that represent a spinning disk. Thos
  12. Yes but by "paradox" we mean an apparent inconsistency within the framework of a theory. It has got nothing to do with observations. And if the theory is actually self-consistent, the solution is also purely logical work. It's just about identifying the error in the assumptions leading to paradox, and how the situation actually must be represented in the framework of that theory. Generally paradoxes are cases of applying the rules of a theory in inconsistent manner. That is exactly what has happened with Ehrenfest Paradox. That is why I'm so surprised that the actual correct, purely logical
  13. Hey Laurie, I remember you from this forum back in the day. I can hardly believe it's been over 10 years... :I Thanks, that was an interesting read. It reinforces my views on the reasons why people tend to get this so wrong. Everyone make a wrong assumption about infinitesimal Lorentz contraction right at the get-go without thinking about it critically. The correct solution does not seem to appear anywhere on that paper (they get the rolling disk case right though. But that's not the original paradox). Truthfully, I'm quite dumbfounded about all of this. The commonly presented solutions
  14. Yeah, I actually discussed that exact topic here http://www.scienceforums.com/topic/35098-relativity-and-simple-algebra/?view=findpost&p=385984 which you might find interesting. Anyway, yeah I would have agreed on that same junction - when Special Relativity was first introduced and it was mathematically exactly identical to Lorentz' latest theory - that redundant concepts are redundant. But then couple years later people invented a new redundant concept, the Minkowski Spacetime, which should have been recognized as equally redundant. But it made great headlines, I guess :shrug: Basical
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