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Us And Iran Troop Deployments


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#35 VictorMedvil

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Posted 27 September 2019 - 03:31 AM

The US is now deploying Patriot missile systems to Saudi Arabia(https://www.cnbc.com...il-attacks.html)



#36 Flummoxed

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Posted 27 September 2019 - 03:46 AM

Here is the absolute truth about this, it is probably all about oil you are right on that respect but it doesn't matter the absolute truth is US is strong and Iran is weak, thus the US is going to obliterate Iran for their oil. Everything past that is just flowery bullshit to make it seem as something its not but that is the truth as I understand it. For instance, a nuclear weapon in 2019 is primitive technology from the 1950s it doesn't matter what Iran thinks they will be conquered if they don't back down.

 

The argument ref nuclear deterrents is mutual total destruction. Degrees of total destruction do not really come into it. If Iran has nuclear weapons, it is less likely that the US will attack them to steal their resources. It is also not in Irans intertests to advertise where it keeps its its nuclear weapons if it has them.  

 

What would be the best way for Iran to deal with the nuclear threats around their borders, from countries wanting to steel their countries resources? 

 

They defended them selves against Iraq, who did not have weapons of mass destruction. They could easily defend them selves against the US if nuclear weapons were not involved.  Bringing nuclear into the fray assures mutual destruction with no winners. Iran might even get nuclear weapons from Russia who is an ally of theirs who Trump is trying to cozy up to.   

 

In the Islamic world other countries without oil developed nuclear weapons covertly years ago. Pakistan already has nuclear weapons, and with their track record of hiding a few international terrorists wanted by the USA and allies, whose side are they really on. They might help their Islamic friends in Iran, whilst appearing to help the fight against the Taliban in Afghanistan.

 

Since Donald Trump is alienating China, why shouldnt China who has the biggest Land Army on the Planet not assist Iran against any greedy mad emperors trying to expand their influence beyond the borders of their empire. :) 



#37 VictorMedvil

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Posted 27 September 2019 - 03:53 AM

The argument ref nuclear deterrents is mutual total destruction. Degrees of total destruction do not really come into it. If Iran has nuclear weapons, it is less likely that the US will attack them to steal their resources. It is also not in Irans intertests to advertise where it keeps its its nuclear weapons if it has them.  

 

What would be the best way for Iran to deal with the nuclear threats around their borders, from countries wanting to steel their countries resources? 

 

They defended them selves against Iraq, who did not have weapons of mass destruction. They could easily defend them selves against the US if nuclear weapons were not involved.  Bringing nuclear into the fray assures mutual destruction with no winners. Iran might even get nuclear weapons from Russia who is an ally of theirs who Trump is trying to cozy up to.   

 

In the Islamic world other countries without oil developed nuclear weapons covertly years ago. Pakistan already has nuclear weapons, and with their track record of hiding a few international terrorists wanted by the USA and allies, whose side are they really on. They might help their Islamic friends in Iran, whilst appearing to help the fight against the Taliban in Afghanistan.

 

Since Donald Trump is alienating China, why shouldnt China who has the biggest Land Army on the Planet not assist Iran against any greedy mad emperors trying to expand their influence beyond the borders of their empire. :)

 

Another point is this do you think that the US will not attack a nuclear power if you think that you are wrong because we didn't attack Iraq until we thought they had Weapons of Mass Destruction, I think you underestimate the power of the US's Military might and the US's ability to fight an enemy that we truly hate, we have been able to shoot down nuclear missiles since like the 80s. There is a mutual assured destruction between the US and Russia but between any other country on the planet there is no Mutual assured destruction that exists as they don't have enough nuclear weapons to actually challenge our ability to shoot it or them down.

 

 


Edited by VictorMedvil, 27 September 2019 - 04:13 AM.


#38 Flummoxed

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Posted 27 September 2019 - 04:28 AM

Another point is this do you think that the US will not attack a nuclear power if you think that you are wrong because we didn't attack Iraq until we thought they had Weapons of Mass Destruction, I think you underestimate the power of the US's Military might and the US's ability to fight an enemy that we truly hate, we have been able to shoot down nuclear missiles since like the 80s. There is a mutual assured destruction between the US and Russia but between any other country on the planet there is no Mutual assured destruction that exists as they don't have enough nuclear weapons to actually challenge our ability to shoot it or them down.

 

 

 

 

America has not attacked Russia or China, it has no influence over them except for trade, mutual destruction is a deterrent is it not. America is still on paper at war with North Korea, it does not have the troops to win a war with a small country never mind Iran. The obvious defense method for Iran would be terrorism. You can not shoot down nuclear weapons or bombs of any kind, if they are already in your cities or on board oil tankers stolen from the Iranians. In america there are a large number of Moslems, you have freedom of religion, who might be sympathetic to a foreign Islamic cause, not unlike the Jews in America are to Israel. 

 

Have you met any Iranians, ie why do you hate them.? and who is this we pale face :) Do you include everyone in America or is this just the select few where you reside ? Should any one disagreeing with the select few be imprisoned, executed or sent to Iowa :)



#39 VictorMedvil

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Posted 27 September 2019 - 04:34 AM

America has not attacked Russia or China, it has no influence over them except for trade, mutual destruction is a deterrent is it not. America is still on paper at war with North Korea, it does not have the troops to win a war with a small country never mind Iran. The obvious defense method for Iran would be terrorism. You can not shoot down nuclear weapons or bombs of any kind, if they are already in your cities or on board oil tankers stolen from the Iranians. In america there are a large number of Moslems, you have freedom of religion, who might be sympathetic to a foreign Islamic cause, not unlike the Jews in America are to Israel. 

 

Have you met any Iranians, ie why do you hate them.? and who is this we pale face :) Do you include everyone in America or is this just the select few where you reside ? Should any one disagreeing with the select few be imprisoned, executed or sent to Iowa :)

 

North Korea and Iran are threats to global security thus should be dealt with I used the wrong word "Hate", I meant dislike the way they handle things we don't hate Iranians, we hate global terrorism and Iran's government is apart of that, we being most people in America. It comes down this I have seen enough suicide bombings for one life time, I don't want to see anymore.


Edited by VictorMedvil, 27 September 2019 - 05:16 AM.


#40 Flummoxed

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Posted 27 September 2019 - 06:04 AM

North Korea and Iran are threats to global security thus should be dealt with I used the wrong word "Hate", I meant dislike the way they handle things we don't hate Iranians, we hate global terrorism and Iran's government is apart of that, we being most people in America. It comes down this I have seen enough suicide bombings for one life time, I don't want to see anymore.

 

People the world over do not cause wars, it is governments, who portray rightly or wrongly another country to be an enemy for what ever reason. I am reasonably sure if you went on a tour of Iran you might find some decent people, who just want to get on with their lives.

 

In the case of Iran, I am not sure they 100% the bad guys, they are not trying to police/rule the world. There could be a bit of quid pro quo going on between Iran for its oil and the rest of the world. ie never believe everything politicians say. 

 

I agree North Korea does have what appears to be a nutter in charge, my point was America did not defeat north korea. North Korea is not as powerful as Iran

 

Who defines who is a terrorist and who is a freedom fighter. If you only have a small army, rather than fight head on with a super power, is it not logical to hit them where it hurts and where they cant defend them selves. 

 

A terrorist is a person who uses unlawful violence and intimidation, especially against civilians, in the pursuit of political aims, with in their own country/borders. This is not someone who resists an invading force against their own country by what ever means possible. 



#41 VictorMedvil

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Posted 27 September 2019 - 06:46 AM

People the world over do not cause wars, it is governments, who portray rightly or wrongly another country to be an enemy for what ever reason. I am reasonably sure if you went on a tour of Iran you might find some decent people, who just want to get on with their lives.

 

In the case of Iran, I am not sure they 100% the bad guys, they are not trying to police/rule the world. There could be a bit of quid pro quo going on between Iran for its oil and the rest of the world. ie never believe everything politicians say. 

 

I agree North Korea does have what appears to be a nutter in charge, my point was America did not defeat north korea. North Korea is not as powerful as Iran

 

Who defines who is a terrorist and who is a freedom fighter. If you only have a small army, rather than fight head on with a super power, is it not logical to hit them where it hurts and where they cant defend them selves. 

 

A terrorist is a person who uses unlawful violence and intimidation, especially against civilians, in the pursuit of political aims, with in their own country/borders. This is not someone who resists an invading force against their own country by what ever means possible. 

The War has not begun yet but it will , but we must police the planet as no one else will, North Korea is not a threat they could be stopped in 4 days max, it takes considerable resources to rule a planet which is why the US is 22 trillion dollars in debt maybe you should consider what you would do in our shoes sometime, it is always walking on a razor's edge between right and wrong, keeping power and not keeping power other countries have done this job before but the US is the most humanitarian rulers of the planet this planet has ever seen. They are not freedom fighters they fight to oppress people not to free them, you are confusing whom are the good guys in this, we fight to liberate people not to oppress that has been shown in the liberation of Iraq. Yes, we take their oil but otherwise we would not have the resources to liberate the next group from oppression. Consider this, How was the world different under imperialism versus what it is now doesn't everyone have a voice now. You may hate that people like me hold the power over this world but you must look at it through our view, we are just trying to keep the peace in a hostile world. Who was there when ISIS attacked Europe, that's right the United states and the Russians, you have no idea what it is like for the Russians and United States to always be fighting a sort of cold war yet together rule this world, our decisions effect 11 billion people everyday do you understand the responsibility and challenges faced but even a world divided in half still is better than imperialism.

 

evb1.jpg


Edited by VictorMedvil, 27 September 2019 - 07:02 AM.


#42 LaurieAG

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Posted 27 September 2019 - 09:12 PM

Another point is this do you think that the US will not attack a nuclear power if you think that you are wrong because we didn't attack Iraq until we thought they had Weapons of Mass Destruction, I think you underestimate the power of the US's Military might and the US's ability to fight an enemy that we truly hate, we have been able to shoot down nuclear missiles since like the 80s.

 

Read some history and you would know that Iraq was an ally of the US before the US turned against them. Even Donald Rumsfeld gave Iraq US$1Billion after the Iraq/Iran war because he thought Saddam was such a nice bloke for doing their dirty work.



#43 VictorMedvil

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Posted 28 September 2019 - 01:43 AM

Read some history and you would know that Iraq was an ally of the US before the US turned against them. Even Donald Rumsfeld gave Iraq US$1Billion after the Iraq/Iran war because he thought Saddam was such a nice bloke for doing their dirty work.

Well ya that may be true but still we killed Iraq after it had WMDs, 5000 Kurds which is Saddam's enemy faction didn't just VX gas themselves, politics is a two faced game that doesn't surprise me that the U.S. used them then killed them. That's like I have seen pictures of Bill Clinton shaking hands with Bin Laden which was later killed by the U.S. Government meaning this don't you think stuff like that happens all the time in world politics.


Edited by VictorMedvil, 28 September 2019 - 02:16 AM.


#44 Flummoxed

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Posted 28 September 2019 - 03:22 AM

Well ya that may be true but still we killed Iraq after it had WMDs, 5000 Kurds which is Saddam's enemy faction didn't just VX gas themselves, politics is a two faced game that doesn't surprise me that the U.S. used them then killed them. That's like I have seen pictures of Bill Clinton shaking hands with Bin Laden which was later killed by the U.S. Government meaning this don't you think stuff like that happens all the time in world politics.

 

It was not Clinton who had close ties to the Bin Laden family, it was the Bush family https://www.denverpo...im-anniversary/

 

World police man or world dictatorship, whats the difference. You dragged up Kennedy on an earlier post, he was democrat not republican and a respected world leader, who appeared to be a good fella. Trump is not a respected world leader and never will be. The rest of the world think he is a bit mad not unlike some on this forum apparently :)



#45 VictorMedvil

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Posted 28 September 2019 - 03:24 AM

It was not Clinton who had close ties to the Bin Laden family, it was the Bush family https://www.denverpo...im-anniversary/

 

World police man or world dictatorship, whats the difference. You dragged up Kennedy on an earlier post, he was democrat not republican and a respected world leader, who appeared to be a good fella. Trump is not a respected world leader and never will be. The rest of the world think he is a bit mad not unlike some on this forum apparently :)

 

I think Trump is doing better than Obama, I think you have to be American to understand his knee jerk reaction to these situations. Personally, the thing I was most sick of was China stealing American Patents which he is trying to solve, there is alot of ****ed up stuff the world has done to Americans that we just let slide and Trump is not letting it slide. The Democrats portray Trump as like Satan but he is a hero to many Americans as he stands up against people that have done these things against Americans, we have had a serious problem with South American illegal immigration for a long time some of the things he does you don't understand because you aren't physically here. I actually like the direction he is taking America, Trump doesn't care about you other nations like Obama did, he cares about Americans. No offense to all you Europeans and such but we needed to stop taking care of this world in the same capacity we had been, we needed to take care of some social problems this country had. Another thing that needed to be fixed that was screwed up was Russian violations to the INF, we signed this treaty with Russia just for them to still make INF nuclear weapons constantly breaking their word, so we left that treaty under Trump, Obama would have never done something like that. If Trump is in office it because this world drove the US citizens to the point of electing someone like Trump, basically to say if there is a mad man on the throne of America drove us to the point to put him there.

 

P.S. you think you have it bad, we have to deal with Xi and Putin so don't ever think Trump is that bad.


Edited by VictorMedvil, 28 September 2019 - 03:56 AM.


#46 Flummoxed

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Posted 28 September 2019 - 04:43 AM

I think Trump is doing better than Obama, I think you have to be American to understand his knee jerk reaction to these situations. Personally, the thing I was most sick of was China stealing American Patents which he is trying to solve, there is alot of ****ed up stuff the world has done to Americans that we just let slide and Trump is not letting it slide. The Democrats portray Trump as like Satan but he is a hero to many Americans as he stands up against people that have done these things against Americans, we have had a serious problem with South American illegal immigration for a long time some of the things he does you don't understand because you aren't physically here. I actually like the direction he is taking America, Trump doesn't care about you other nations like Obama did, he cares about Americans. No offense to all you Europeans and such but we needed to stop taking care of this world in the same capacity we had been, we needed to take care of some social problems this country had. Another thing that needed to be fixed that was screwed up was Russian violations to the INF, we signed this treaty with Russia just for them to still make INF nuclear weapons constantly breaking their word, so we left that treaty under Trump, Obama would have never done something like that. If Trump is in office it because this world drove the US citizens to the point of electing someone like Trump, basically to say if there is a mad man on the throne of America drove us to the point to put him there.

 

P.S. you think you have it bad, we have to deal with Xi and Putin so don't ever think Trump is that bad.

 

the American economy is improving under Trump, but this is likely nothing to do with Trump. Most Americans I meet a lot of whom are republicans are embarrassed by Trump. He is a bad joke for many Americans, not unlike Boris Johnson for many in the UK. They have many similar personality traits. 

 

Yes China has a reputation for copying and manufacturing at much lower costs products from the rest of the world. I can think of two cases of the cuff in the UK, where products were copied and exact copies were made. In one instance the chinese company doing the copies purchased a gearbox from a UK company then sent it and the copy back to the UK company, and told the owner they could manufacture the gearbox for less than it could be made in the UK. The director of the UK moved the manufacturing of the gearboxes to China, as it was more profitable for him. He made redundant his workers in that section of the factory. 

 

The original peoples in the whole of north America had a serious problem with immigrants a few hundred years ago. The immigrants stole all the land forcing the original inhabitants onto reservations. :( Those reservations are government owned, so the people living on them can not get loans for equipment to farm the land. They can how ever rent the land out to contractors who come in and farm the land for them.

 

Texas and California did of course belong to Mexico. I am quite sure if Trump agrees to returning California and Texas to the Mexicans they would build a wall free of charge from one side of America to the other :) What would Trump do if Texas decided to leave the Union and join Mexico, and then what if California followed suit, a bit similar to the way Russia has been coming apart? amusing thought perhaps

 

How could a white North American offend a Northern European, You are all descended from us. We are a a mix of Neanderthal 4-6% ish and Homo Sapien whatsits.

Russia is part of the European continent and many Russians did emigrate to America also.

 

There is an interesting book called the Geography of war, which might explain some of Putins actions.

 

I was lead to believe the main reason Trump was elected was because no one wanted Hilary Clinton, and the religious nutters would rather vote for a nutter, than a sane person. 

 

China has been none expansionist for centuries, although they do appear to be building up some attols in the China sea which could control the trade routes in that part of the world. The Chinese are expanding their influence through trade, at the moment not military force. 

 

Ref Russia are they not a bit like America, could this be why Trump and Putin cosey up to each other at every opportunity. Is it it in Americas and Russias best interest to see the break up of the European union. USA might find reduced trading standards easier to comply with, and USSR might not feel so threatened by countries wanting to leave the block and join the Eurropean Union.



#47 VictorMedvil

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Posted 29 September 2019 - 06:13 AM

the American economy is improving under Trump, but this is likely nothing to do with Trump. Most Americans I meet a lot of whom are republicans are embarrassed by Trump. He is a bad joke for many Americans, not unlike Boris Johnson for many in the UK. They have many similar personality traits. 

 

Yes China has a reputation for copying and manufacturing at much lower costs products from the rest of the world. I can think of two cases of the cuff in the UK, where products were copied and exact copies were made. In one instance the chinese company doing the copies purchased a gearbox from a UK company then sent it and the copy back to the UK company, and told the owner they could manufacture the gearbox for less than it could be made in the UK. The director of the UK moved the manufacturing of the gearboxes to China, as it was more profitable for him. He made redundant his workers in that section of the factory. 

 

The original peoples in the whole of north America had a serious problem with immigrants a few hundred years ago. The immigrants stole all the land forcing the original inhabitants onto reservations. :( Those reservations are government owned, so the people living on them can not get loans for equipment to farm the land. They can how ever rent the land out to contractors who come in and farm the land for them.

 

Texas and California did of course belong to Mexico. I am quite sure if Trump agrees to returning California and Texas to the Mexicans they would build a wall free of charge from one side of America to the other :) What would Trump do if Texas decided to leave the Union and join Mexico, and then what if California followed suit, a bit similar to the way Russia has been coming apart? amusing thought perhaps

 

How could a white North American offend a Northern European, You are all descended from us. We are a a mix of Neanderthal 4-6% ish and Homo Sapien whatsits.

Russia is part of the European continent and many Russians did emigrate to America also.

 

There is an interesting book called the Geography of war, which might explain some of Putins actions.

 

I was lead to believe the main reason Trump was elected was because no one wanted Hilary Clinton, and the religious nutters would rather vote for a nutter, than a sane person. 

 

China has been none expansionist for centuries, although they do appear to be building up some attols in the China sea which could control the trade routes in that part of the world. The Chinese are expanding their influence through trade, at the moment not military force. 

 

Ref Russia are they not a bit like America, could this be why Trump and Putin cosey up to each other at every opportunity. Is it it in Americas and Russias best interest to see the break up of the European union. USA might find reduced trading standards easier to comply with, and USSR might not feel so threatened by countries wanting to leave the block and join the Eurropean Union.

 

But see you are missing the aspect of power again, Mexico is not powerful enough to force the US to do anything, Just like the EU has had US support to defend itself for like 20 years to 50 years , the only nation of earth that can force the US to do anything is Russia, I think you are missing some key things about how this world works. To put it in terms you will understand it is like the native Americans they were weaker than the people trying to colonize them thus were killed and sent to reservations that is the cruel truth about how humans operate on that scale which is why what weaker nations want is irrelevant. The only opinion that really counts in this world is that of the E.U.,Russia,U.S., and China in the grand scheme of things, because of industrial and military might, the other nations would be like putting a normal person in a boxing match with a professional boxer, you are obviously going to lose to the professional boxer. You forget that the U.S. has the industrial and military might to fight the entire planet on equal terms if such a situation arose, the only people that would give a challenge to that is the Russians, all that to say we don't have to make trades like that.

 

theodore-roosevelt-quote.jpg


Edited by VictorMedvil, 29 September 2019 - 06:30 AM.


#48 Flummoxed

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Posted 30 September 2019 - 02:59 AM

But see you are missing the aspect of power again, Mexico is not powerful enough to force the US to do anything, Just like the EU has had US support to defend itself for like 20 years to 50 years , the only nation of earth that can force the US to do anything is Russia, I think you are missing some key things about how this world works. To put it in terms you will understand it is like the native Americans they were weaker than the people trying to colonize them thus were killed and sent to reservations that is the cruel truth about how humans operate on that scale which is why what weaker nations want is irrelevant. The only opinion that really counts in this world is that of the E.U.,Russia,U.S., and China in the grand scheme of things, because of industrial and military might, the other nations would be like putting a normal person in a boxing match with a professional boxer, you are obviously going to lose to the professional boxer. You forget that the U.S. has the industrial and military might to fight the entire planet on equal terms if such a situation arose, the only people that would give a challenge to that is the Russians, all that to say we don't have to make trades like that.

 

theodore-roosevelt-quote.jpg

 

Victor Ex chem is right you are mad, you do know that dont you :) 



#49 VictorMedvil

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Posted 30 September 2019 - 04:01 AM

Victor Ex chem is right you are mad, you do know that dont you :)

 

Don't make me go off on another rant about power and you won't think so, why should the weak get in the way of the strong? I believe in absolute and unlimited power unrestrained by those without imagination of what could be, You know powerful humans used to be worshiped as Gods.

During-the-next-500-years-the-Egyptians-

 

Then it was only God could judge the powerful.....https://en.wikipedia..._right_of_kings

laurits-tuxen-1898-coronation-of-nichola

 

Now the writing on the wall asks "Shall we all become as powerful as Gods and bask in our immortality?"

human-immortality-prediction-2.jpg

 

In the end you will find no God other than power.

v3wmxsrayt65fsa8ohnu.jpg


Edited by VictorMedvil, 30 September 2019 - 02:19 PM.


#50 VictorMedvil

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Posted 08 October 2019 - 03:08 AM

Look at this, see I told you...... This talks about a blitz plan for taking Iran out in 1 day and they literally think they can pull it off(https://www.express....hran-washington)