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America's Failed Health Care System.


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#1 montgomery

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 12:53 PM

The US system has failed miserably and is rated at around 37th. by the WHO. It is the lowest rated of all the modern first world countries. 

 

Canada's health care system, as an example of a lower rated universal health care system is rated at around 30th. in the world by the WHO. And Canada's health care system costs a little more than half as much per capita as the US system.

 

Americans are very unhappy with their health care system because it doesn't cover all the people and it leaves many millions facing bankrupcy if they are unfortunate enough to suffer a significant injury or illness. 

 

The favourite talking point of Americans who still try to defend their system is: https://www.medpaget...ysyndrome/18279

 

It's pointing out that some very wealthy Canadians will jump the queue in order to get medical attention quicker. This is undoubtedly true in a few isolated cases but it also calls for a closer examination of the facts.

 

Easily as many Americans travel to other countries as Canadians travel to the US, (per capita) This is because health care in the US is too costly for the ordinary American who can't afford insurance coverage.

 

It also has to be noted that Canadians travelling to the US for health care are in most cases, paid to do so by the Canadian system. That's not so with Americans who travel to other countries..

 

More recent studies than the outdated WHO study are showing that America's health care lags far behind the leading single payer, universal health care systems of the world. 

 

America's large insurance companies have billions to lose in profits off the backs of the American people. For that reason they spend billions on promoting the present system. Many of the American people are actually propagandized into believing that the rest of the world is wrong on their choices of a univesral health care system that is always cheaper to afford and takes care of the medical needs of all the people!

 

This is a quick introduction to the facts from a Canadian.There is so much more to say to Americans on the issue!  

 

Another link to make the point: https://www.thisisin...althcare-2018-6

 


  • Most Americans who travel for medical procedures claim that, despite the low cost of health services in other countries, the quality is comparable — or even superior — to that of the US.

Edited by montgomery, 10 February 2019 - 01:02 PM.


#2 GAHD

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 03:18 PM

Point the first: "Canada's health care system costs a little more than half as much per capita as the US system" Can I get a source on that?

Point the second: "It also has to be noted that Canadians travelling to the US for health care are in most cases, paid to do so by the Canadian system." What? Source on that? Fairly certain the people I know who flew to the mayo paid out of pocket, not with their medicare card. I'm reeeeaaaalllly skeptical of this claim.

This guy addressees a lot of issues with Canada's system. He also helps debunk you claim that it's "always cheaper to afford and takes care of the medical needs of all the people!"  Guess where he was born?


The cost is merely passed on to everyone though taxes and cross-charges, EG by draining cash out of things like CPP.
I don't call it "cheaper" when I havn't had a health issue in over 15 years other than some lung infections(which I had to pay for medication for) and a busted knee(which they couldn't do anything about, told me to "take it easy and let it heal" while I paid for the painkillers). Though all that the money I paid in taxes was funneled into the system for other people to use, not for ME to use in the care that was needed. That's a theft when you bother to think of it. I wonder why there's still workplace health plans to cover incidental costs? Maybe private insurance is still REQUIRED despite the "free healthcare" ?
I mean, I don't even bother going to doctors for things unless I NEED to get a doctors note(which I have to pay for) anymore because by the time I get to see one, it's often too late and personal first aid has already done the best they can do. Eg Degloving of a finger, if I had not done personal self treatment I'd have lost the end of my finger due to bloodflow issues before I got to see a doctor in triage SIX HOURS LATER, and only that "fast" because the gause I'd wrapped it in was terrifying the nurses.
How about the elderly who have to wait over a YEAR to see a specialist, and by the time they do "if we'd caught it six moths ago there would have been a higher chance" ? Like the ex-Canuk in the video says "Take that example of the post office, and add cancer"
 



#3 montgomery

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 04:27 PM

https://www.healthsy...alth-u-s-spends

 

My mistake, Canada's cost per capita is 'less' than half the cost of the US mess.

 

https://learningengl...re/3648328.html

More Americans leave their country for health care than Canadians leave Canada.

 

 

 

Between 750,000 and 1.8 million Americans leave the country for medical reasons every year because of the high costs of treatments and surgeries. Page says Mexico is a common choice for American medical tourists.

“For Americans, the main destination is Mexico due to its geographical proximityand the relation(ship) between both countries. The main reason is treatment for cancer,” he said.


Edited by montgomery, 10 February 2019 - 04:57 PM.


#4 montgomery

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 04:57 PM

https://www.quora.co...e-American-ones

 

There are times when a Canadian patient is sent to the US for treatment. This can occur when a patient urgently needs treatment that is not available in the Canadian province where they live. (This happens rarely)

Edited by montgomery, 10 February 2019 - 05:00 PM.


#5 montgomery

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 05:12 PM

Point the first: "Canada's health care system costs a little more than half as much per capita as the US system" Can I get a source on that?

Point the second: "It also has to be noted that Canadians travelling to the US for health care are in most cases, paid to do so by the Canadian system." What? Source on that? Fairly certain the people I know who flew to the mayo paid out of pocket, not with their medicare card. I'm reeeeaaaalllly skeptical of this claim.

This guy addressees a lot of issues with Canada's system. He also helps debunk you claim that it's "always cheaper to afford and takes care of the medical needs of all the people!"  Guess where he was born?


The cost is merely passed on to everyone though taxes and cross-charges, EG by draining cash out of things like CPP.
I don't call it "cheaper" when I havn't had a health issue in over 15 years other than some lung infections(which I had to pay for medication for) and a busted knee(which they couldn't do anything about, told me to "take it easy and let it heal" while I paid for the painkillers). Though all that the money I paid in taxes was funneled into the system for other people to use, not for ME to use in the care that was needed. That's a theft when you bother to think of it. I wonder why there's still workplace health plans to cover incidental costs? Maybe private insurance is still REQUIRED despite the "free healthcare" ?
I mean, I don't even bother going to doctors for things unless I NEED to get a doctors note(which I have to pay for) anymore because by the time I get to see one, it's often too late and personal first aid has already done the best they can do. Eg Degloving of a finger, if I had not done personal self treatment I'd have lost the end of my finger due to bloodflow issues before I got to see a doctor in triage SIX HOURS LATER, and only that "fast" because the gause I'd wrapped it in was terrifying the nurses.
How about the elderly who have to wait over a YEAR to see a specialist, and by the time they do "if we'd caught it six moths ago there would have been a higher chance" ? Like the ex-Canuk in the video says "Take that example of the post office, and add cancer"
 

Your guy is right that our health care is paid out of taxes. Nobody would actually dispute that. 

 

The fact is Gahd, Canada's health care is rated as better than the US's and it's less than half the cost to the country per capita. And, more Americans leave their country for health care than do Canadians leave Canada. (per capita) If you're a Canadian why are you failing to take the same side of this debate that I'm taking? Has the Fraser Institute convinced you of Trump's lies on the matter? Would you care to see a link to a site that rebuts the Trump lies?

 

Maybe Moronium has the balls to get into this subject. We need a brave American to  debate for their side. And a very stupid one of course because they just don't have a case!

 

I suggest that any further defense of Trump you may have, should be taken to the Trump examination thread.

 

A hint: Never try to rebut anything I say on Canada/US health care. You'll be walking right into a setup. 



#6 GAHD

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 05:20 PM

https://www.healthsy...alth-u-s-spends

 

My mistake, Canada's cost per capita is 'less' than half the cost of the US mess.

 

https://learningengl...re/3648328.html

More Americans leave their country for health care than Canadians leave Canada.

I'll look into that first one a bit more. I'm finding it suspect but I'm open to being wrong about it. It's saying as a percent of GDP, which just means that the medical industry has a large volume of money flowing though it, not that per-treatment costs are more expensive I wager. It's also using number AFTER Obamacare/medicaid double-pay is introduced, which is one of the major things the anti-obamacare people were griping about. Paying twice. I think that video from crowder mentions it in passing too: two-tier system and paying twice.

That second one looks like "for elective surgeries" to me, not actual health care so much. Even the article itself says that the USA is second on the list of global medical tourism, from it:

 

Page says the top country for medical tourism is Thailand. The United States is second. He says the United States is “a country with a level of specialized medicine not found elsewhere.”

I'm curious if that would truncate the first link you gave there and inflate the "private sector" GDP correspondingly. I also noticed when I started looking into their datasets "united states" is absent from many (not all by far, but just not listed under certain categories) while those that are listed show a correspondingly large hike in incidents compared to other countries: eg twice the infectious disease rate (more vectors I assume, or just more people able to access it and thus "get on the books" possibly? Needs further review).

It does seem to paint the recent socialist stick-on to the capitalist system as a ballooning financial upheaval though, doesn't it?

Edit:

 

 

 "very rarely" is quite different than "It also has to be noted that Canadians travelling to the US for health care are in most cases, paid to do so by the Canadian system" is it not? Also, Quara isn't really a very good thing other than for anecdotes, but I'll take it as it lays absent other thing like MRI scans.
Those seem to fall in at around $400-700 USD for ones that seem to be using similar tech to the private clinics in canada for around $700-900 CA, with "right noww" services and newer higher tesla scans running upwards of $2000-3000 USD. I'm thinking the high end there is a get what you pay for scenario? Not sure, but there's definately competitive price points, and much different wait times.



#7 montgomery

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 10:27 PM

I'll look into that first one a bit more. I'm finding it suspect but I'm open to being wrong about it. It's saying as a percent of GDP, which just means that the medical industry has a large volume of money flowing though it, not that per-treatment costs are more expensive I wager. It's also using number AFTER Obamacare/medicaid double-pay is introduced, which is one of the major things the anti-obamacare people were griping about. Paying twice. I think that video from crowder mentions it in passing too: two-tier system and paying twice.

That second one looks like "for elective surgeries" to me, not actual health care so much. Even the article itself says that the USA is second on the list of global medical tourism, from it:

 


I'm curious if that would truncate the first link you gave there and inflate the "private sector" GDP correspondingly. I also noticed when I started looking into their datasets "united states" is absent from many (not all by far, but just not listed under certain categories) while those that are listed show a correspondingly large hike in incidents compared to other countries: eg twice the infectious disease rate (more vectors I assume, or just more people able to access it and thus "get on the books" possibly? Needs further review).

It does seem to paint the recent socialist stick-on to the capitalist system as a ballooning financial upheaval though, doesn't it?

Edit:

 

 

 "very rarely" is quite different than "It also has to be noted that Canadians travelling to the US for health care are in most cases, paid to do so by the Canadian system" is it not? Also, Quara isn't really a very good thing other than for anecdotes, but I'll take it as it lays absent other thing like MRI scans.
Those seem to fall in at around $400-700 USD for ones that seem to be using similar tech to the private clinics in canada for around $700-900 CA, with "right noww" services and newer higher tesla scans running upwards of $2000-3000 USD. I'm thinking the high end there is a get what you pay for scenario? Not sure, but there's definately competitive price points, and much different wait times.

While you're catching up working on that, I'll just move on to some information on why the US system is the worst.

https://www.theatlan...-report/533634/

 

Take your time, this **** isn't new! 

 

Check out the graph in which those happiest countries start popping up again! 


Edited by montgomery, 10 February 2019 - 10:30 PM.


#8 hazelm

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 08:03 AM

The US system has failed miserably and is rated at around 37th. by the WHO. It is the lowest rated of all the modern first world countries. 

 

Canada's health care system, as an example of a lower rated universal health care system is rated at around 30th. in the world by the WHO. And Canada's health care system costs a little more than half as much per capita as the US system.

 

Americans are very unhappy with their health care system because it doesn't cover all the people and it leaves many millions facing bankrupcy if they are unfortunate enough to suffer a significant injury or illness. 

 

The favourite talking point of Americans who still try to defend their system is: https://www.medpaget...ysyndrome/18279

 

It's pointing out that some very wealthy Canadians will jump the queue in order to get medical attention quicker. This is undoubtedly true in a few isolated cases but it also calls for a closer examination of the facts.

 

Easily as many Americans travel to other countries as Canadians travel to the US, (per capita) This is because health care in the US is too costly for the ordinary American who can't afford insurance coverage.

 

It also has to be noted that Canadians travelling to the US for health care are in most cases, paid to do so by the Canadian system. That's not so with Americans who travel to other countries..

 

More recent studies than the outdated WHO study are showing that America's health care lags far behind the leading single payer, universal health care systems of the world. 

 

America's large insurance companies have billions to lose in profits off the backs of the American people. For that reason they spend billions on promoting the present system. Many of the American people are actually propagandized into believing that the rest of the world is wrong on their choices of a univesral health care system that is always cheaper to afford and takes care of the medical needs of all the people!

 

This is a quick introduction to the facts from a Canadian.There is so much more to say to Americans on the issue!  

 

Another link to make the point: https://www.thisisin...althcare-2018-6

Montgomery,  while your points are well-taken, they are only a part of it.  And, to my notion, not the  most important part.   Everyone addresses the insurance problem.  No one addresses the actual care.    There are so many issues to what makes a good health care system.   "Quality of care"?   This is what I hear friends and neighbors talk about.  Comment?



#9 Flummoxed

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 09:12 AM

Montgomery,  while your points are well-taken, they are only a part of it.  And, to my notion, not the  most important part.   Everyone addresses the insurance problem.  No one addresses the actual care.    There are so many issues to what makes a good health care system.   "Quality of care"?   This is what I hear friends and neighbors talk about.  Comment?

 

The insurance question is very interesting.

 

Having only visited the states once, I am no expert, and am most likely incorrect. Am I correct in thinking that even though some one has health insurance in the states, they still have to pay 10% of the cost of drugs? The reason I ask this in most parts of the world, drugs bought direct from pharmacies, appear to be only 10% of the cost you pay in the states. Drugs that can be bought over the counter for pain relief like Paracetamol or Ibuprofen every where else in the world cannot be bought in the states without a doctors prescription, adding further to the expense.

 

I also note the comment on health tourism in the OP. The private hospitals and clinics around the world I have seen are generally first class modern hospitals with all the latest equipment. I noted whilst on a trip to Malaysia the hospitals are very modern, and was given a tour around one, promoting its services to foreigners. Also in Venezuela there are modern private hospitals, whereby you can have all your medical procedures carried out and recover for a fraction of the cost it is in the states. I had a root filling done for 100US$ How much would the same be in America or Canada. Why not have a holiday in the sun and get fixed up at the same time.



#10 hazelm

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 09:38 AM

The insurance question is very interesting.

 

Having only visited the states once, I am no expert, and am most likely incorrect. Am I correct in thinking that even though some one has health insurance in the states, they still have to pay 10% of the cost of drugs? The reason I ask this in most parts of the world, drugs bought direct from pharmacies, appear to be only 10% of the cost you pay in the states. Drugs that can be bought over the counter for pain relief like Paracetamol or Ibuprofen every where else in the world cannot be bought in the states without a doctors prescription, adding further to the expense.

 

I also note the comment on health tourism in the OP. The private hospitals and clinics around the world I have seen are generally first class modern hospitals with all the latest equipment. I noted whilst on a trip to Malaysia the hospitals are very modern, and was given a tour around one, promoting its services to foreigners. Also in Venezuela there are modern private hospitals, whereby you can have all your medical procedures carried out and recover for a fraction of the cost it is in the states. I had a root filling done for 100US$ How much would the same be in America or Canada. Why not have a holiday in the sun and get fixed up at the same time.

Well,  I didn't ask an insurance question but if you want a reply:  Not having prescription insurance,  I cannot answer that part.  I pay 100% of my Rx costs.  I do understand there are some insurance policies that cover Rx.  Not mine.  Then there is Medicare's Part D.  Neither do I have that. There is something about a "gap" where the patient pays - I think - everything.  That's after they've used up a portion of their insurance.  I have a friend who has Part D Rx insurance.  I'll see what she says.

 

As for over the counter drugs:  I am not familiar with Paracetamel.  Ibuprofin - last I knew - is/was available over the counter.  So is Tylenol, by the way.   Some years ago, a Canadian friend mentioned a common pain medication that they cannot buy over the counter and we can.  There are cases where one country or another will ban a certain medicine while still another is allowing the same.  Who knows why?

 

 

So, I'm not much help there.  Mainly this is because I do not take much medicine.  If you take no more medicine than I do, it is cheaper to just pay for what you get.  Maybe someone else can help.



#11 Flummoxed

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 10:11 AM

Well,  I didn't ask an insurance question but if you want a reply:  Not having prescription insurance,  I cannot answer that part.  I pay 100% of my Rx costs.  I do understand there are some insurance policies that cover Rx.  Not mine.  Then there is Medicare's Part D.  Neither do I have that. There is something about a "gap" where the patient pays - I think - everything.  That's after they've used up a portion of their insurance.  I have a friend who has Part D Rx insurance.  I'll see what she says.

 

As for over the counter drugs:  I am not familiar with Paracetamel.  Ibuprofin - last I knew - is/was available over the counter.  So is Tylenol, by the way.   Some years ago, a Canadian friend mentioned a common pain medication that they cannot buy over the counter and we can.  There are cases where one country or another will ban a certain medicine while still another is allowing the same.  Who knows why?

 

 

So, I'm not much help there.  Mainly this is because I do not take much medicine.  If you take no more medicine than I do, it is cheaper to just pay for what you get.  Maybe someone else can help.

 

Paracetomol is a pain killer, very good for cerebral odemas.

 

I think the restrictions on drugs in various countries is so that you can not harm your self by accident, like you can with a gun :) Also unelected pharmaceutical and gun lobby groups pay for people to get elected.

 

In some countries there is virtually no restriction on what drugs you can buy over the counter, but you cant buy guns because you might harm someone :) and unelected lobby groups do not have much influence

 

Could various unelected Lobby groups in the States be exerting pressure on elected officials to promote products and services, driving up costs of health care.

 

I dont get ill.  Except I will go and see a dermatologist especialista next week to have a suspect cancer patch on my lip frozen off. Expected cost < 100 Euros, in and out same day. Alternatively I could use the local FOC health care and wait 2 or 3 months and see the same specialista. 

 

How much is it to see a specialist doctor in the states? How much then for treatment ? How long do you have to wait? 

 

:) Just think if the US hadnt gained independence, it could have a national health service just the same as everyone else in the UK, and there wouldnt be a President, and guns would be illegal etc etc 

:)  


Edited by Flummoxed, 11 February 2019 - 10:12 AM.


#12 hazelm

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 10:47 AM

Paracetomol is a pain killer, very good for cerebral odemas.

 

I think the restrictions on drugs in various countries is so that you can not harm your self by accident, like you can with a gun :) Also unelected pharmaceutical and gun lobby groups pay for people to get elected.

 

In some countries there is virtually no restriction on what drugs you can buy over the counter, but you cant buy guns because you might harm someone :) and unelected lobby groups do not have much influence

 

Could various unelected Lobby groups in the States be exerting pressure on elected officials to promote products and services, driving up costs of health care.

 

I dont get ill.  Except I will go and see a dermatologist especialista next week to have a suspect cancer patch on my lip frozen off. Expected cost < 100 Euros, in and out same day. Alternatively I could use the local FOC health care and wait 2 or 3 months and see the same specialista. 

 

How much is it to see a specialist doctor in the states? How much then for treatment ? How long do you have to wait? 

 

:) Just think if the US hadnt gained independence, it could have a national health service just the same as everyone else in the UK, and there wouldnt be a President, and guns would be illegal etc etc 

:)  

First, answer to Ibuprofen.  Yes, it is available over the counter.  Evidently in a lot of forms that I didn't know.  My friend wrote:  Yes, Brands: Advil, NeoProfen, Caldolor, Children's Profen IB, Infant's Advil, Infant's Ibuprofen, I-Prin, Children's Ibuprofen, Motrin IB, Advil Migraine, and more.

 

Looks like we are a well-drugged country. 

 

It is a bit hard for me to say what a dermatologist charges for freezing because mine bills Medicare which pays her far less than she bills.  Thing is I don't know if what she bills Medicare is her usual full charge or not.  As for waiting,  I never have a long wait.  If it needs attention soon, she fits me in.  If not, probably two or three days.

 

That a regular dermatologist. A specialist like one who does Mohs surgery,  I saw one for consultation a couple of weeks ago and will have the surgery next week.  So, about three weeks for this one. 

 

Much of the difference between countries is who is in control.  Here the medical and/or private insurance industry is in control.  Government may pass certain laws as to what they can and cannot do.  But patient deals directly with the doctors they want.  Britain and Canada have a different system.  That's why comparing them is so difficult.  I have a friend who spent four years in Wales and she loved the medical system. 

 

As for lobbies, they exist everywhere.  I have never heard of any directly promoting certain products but they do work to promote laws that are beneficial to the industry as a whole.  Everyone does that.  Doesn't make it right but there you are.  Something that used to exist but no longer does (so far as we know) because laws were passed to forbid it is pharmaceutical influence on doctors.  A pharmaceutical representative would go from doctor to doctor, give them samples of their products and - worse - treat them to great vacation trips, etc.  That is now illegal. 


Edited by hazelm, 11 February 2019 - 10:51 AM.


#13 montgomery

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 11:38 AM

Montgomery,  while your points are well-taken, they are only a part of it.  And, to my notion, not the  most important part.   Everyone addresses the insurance problem.  No one addresses the actual care.    There are so many issues to what makes a good health care system.   "Quality of care"?   This is what I hear friends and neighbors talk about.  Comment?

Thanks for the comment! I didn't intend to tell the whole story about US health care and insurance costs in my OP. But all the details will probably come out as this thread is developed further. Please add your remarks.

 

To introduce another issue on health care: In Canada we adhere to the logic of making sure everybody has affordable and quality health care. It is perhaps partly because we understand that if our citizens are left untreated early on, they will develop more sever illnesses or complications with injuries. And also there has to be the humanitarian factor where we actually care about the wellness of our fellow Canadians.

 

In the US this differs in both cases to some degree and it's easy to find references to that fact if one searches the internet. The US has, rightly or wrongly, an attitude of everybody being responsible for themselves, to a larger degree than do Canadians.

 

The only path to better health care for all the people, and keeping it affordable is through universal health care. America's legislators know this, on both sides of the aisle, but are prevented from doing right for their constituents due to big money lobbying.


Edited by montgomery, 11 February 2019 - 11:53 AM.


#14 hazelm

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 12:15 PM

Thanks for the comment! I didn't intend to tell the whole story about US health care and insurance costs in my OP. But all the details will probably come out as this thread is developed further. Please add your remarks.

 

To introduce another issue on health care: In Canada we adhere to the logic of making sure everybody has affordable and quality health care. It is perhaps partly because we understand that if our citizens are left untreated early on, they will develop more sever illnesses or complications with injuries. And also there has to be the humanitarian factor where we actually care about the wellness of our fellow Canadians.

 

In the US this differs in both cases to some degree and it's easy to find references to that fact if one searches the internet. The US has, rightly or wrongly, an attitude of everybody being responsible for themselves, to a larger degree than do Canadians.

 

The only path to better health care for all the people, and keeping it affordable is through universal health care. America's legislators know this, on both sides of the aisle, but are prevented from doing right for their constituents due to big money lobbying.

Good points, yes.  My intention was to say that more than having insurance is involved.  The medical world itself (ignoring insurance) has changed drastically and  it isn't all good.  I recently spent about a week in a hospital.  First one I'd been in in thirty-some years.  So very different.  I don't know how to explain it.  Don't know if what I think I observed is what really is or my imagination.  But reading reviews and talking with neighbors,  some of it is definitely right.  I am hoping people on this thread can make some comments for comparison.  Maybe I am wrong.  I hope so. 



#15 montgomery

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 12:33 PM

Good points, yes.  My intention was to say that more than having insurance is involved.  The medical world itself (ignoring insurance) has changed drastically and  it isn't all good.  I recently spent about a week in a hospital.  First one I'd been in in thirty-some years.  So very different.  I don't know how to explain it.  Don't know if what I think I observed is what really is or my imagination.  But reading reviews and talking with neighbors,  some of it is definitely right.  I am hoping people on this thread can make some comments for comparison.  Maybe I am wrong.  I hope so. 

Tell us about your bad experience. Or your imagined bad experience, whichever is the case. You've left it a complete mystery.



#16 montgomery

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 12:35 PM

Point the first: "Canada's health care system costs a little more than half as much per capita as the US system" Can I get a source on that?

Point the second: "It also has to be noted that Canadians travelling to the US for health care are in most cases, paid to do so by the Canadian system." What? Source on that? Fairly certain the people I know who flew to the mayo paid out of pocket, not with their medicare card. I'm reeeeaaaalllly skeptical of this claim.

This guy addressees a lot of issues with Canada's system. He also helps debunk you claim that it's "always cheaper to afford and takes care of the medical needs of all the people!"  Guess where he was born?


The cost is merely passed on to everyone though taxes and cross-charges, EG by draining cash out of things like CPP.
I don't call it "cheaper" when I havn't had a health issue in over 15 years other than some lung infections(which I had to pay for medication for) and a busted knee(which they couldn't do anything about, told me to "take it easy and let it heal" while I paid for the painkillers). Though all that the money I paid in taxes was funneled into the system for other people to use, not for ME to use in the care that was needed. That's a theft when you bother to think of it. I wonder why there's still workplace health plans to cover incidental costs? Maybe private insurance is still REQUIRED despite the "free healthcare" ?
I mean, I don't even bother going to doctors for things unless I NEED to get a doctors note(which I have to pay for) anymore because by the time I get to see one, it's often too late and personal first aid has already done the best they can do. Eg Degloving of a finger, if I had not done personal self treatment I'd have lost the end of my finger due to bloodflow issues before I got to see a doctor in triage SIX HOURS LATER, and only that "fast" because the gause I'd wrapped it in was terrifying the nurses.
How about the elderly who have to wait over a YEAR to see a specialist, and by the time they do "if we'd caught it six moths ago there would have been a higher chance" ? Like the ex-Canuk in the video says "Take that example of the post office, and add cancer"
 

The only rebuttal that need answer to this nonsense is that taxes are roughly equal in the US and Canada. 



#17 hazelm

hazelm

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 12:59 PM

Tell us about your bad experience. Or your imagined bad experience, whichever is the case. You've left it a complete mystery.

It's a fair requesi,Montgomery.  But I was rather hoping there would be others who would comment on today's medical care.  All I will say now is that my recent experience showed a very different attitude toward patients.  Lack of communication, failure to report results and decisions for care to patients, failure to listen to and consider patient's complaints.  Had I not known I could ask for my medical records, I'd never have known what they found and recommended -although a lot of the recommendations were never started and some of what was in the report as having happened did not.

 

But, you see.  I do not know the other side.  I am not familiar with medical practice.  I've always stayed as far from the medical world as I could.  I only know it is far different from today than it was thirty years ago.  It's most a sense I get.

 

Enough from me.  Just going by your OP, I wanted to say there's more to evaluating a system than its insurance.