Tim_Lou Posted July 12, 2004 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 for information about his death:"...he was assassinated by the KGB. he felt the pain of being crushed beneath car wheels as he was run over twice by the same vehicle." "his body was taken to the morgue. morgues in tbilsi are not like those in the us. there bodies are quickfrozen immediately and kept in that state a full 3 days b4 any autopsy is performed of the body is dispensed...." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Martin Posted July 13, 2004 Report Share Posted July 13, 2004 Tim, Get real, your new credit card is NOT going to buy you a ticket to "heaven"!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tormod Posted July 13, 2004 Report Share Posted July 13, 2004 Originally posted by: IrishEyesTormod as an owl is an obvious kiss-up to the site editor as a deliverer of wisdom, but I think we all know that it's Yvonne that has THAT market cornered... Harumpfff...missed this one...I am of course a big bad tiger in my dreams, and a bad-*** maniacal lone wolf in my real life. Fits my profile, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freethinker Posted July 13, 2004 Report Share Posted July 13, 2004 Tim we went thru this before. If you want to believe in this mystical nosnese, no one can stop you. I have shown how this is nothing more than anecdotal evidence with no control data behind it. It even states that his body was put in a condition that would stop the body from deteriorating and would not be subject to close examination for some time. Thus he was NOT shown to be DEAD at any point. It was ASSUMED and his body treated AS IF. Big deal! As to the whole baby thing. All we have is that he KNEW his neighbor was having a child. And that he correctl GUESSED at a fairly typical diagnosis, broken hip. Do you know the history of the mother? Perhaps previous similar instances? Phsyical conditions such as the percent of broken hips at this hospital (it really is a common thing, along with displaced shoulders) mothers appearance can even suggest it happening. This really is so usless as any FACTUAL support of a REAL DEATH experience that no valid scientist would even consider accepting it. But you seem so determined to blindly believe, ... Oh, if your Credit Card has enough room, I have some property in Florida I can give you a real deal on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
galaxy Posted July 17, 2004 Report Share Posted July 17, 2004 I also believe in the possibility of life after death in the physical. I know that there is a reason for our existence on earth, we might have a mission, or it may be simply a test of how much we can endure and what we did with our talents (many of you guys have many) to contribute with humanity. That is just my personal opinion. I agree with Mantra Man, we cannot rule any possibilities just for the simple fact that man has not found a scientific evidence...yet. If humans were always close minded we would still believe that the earth is flat ... there probably wouldn't be any continent called "America" and history itself would have been totally different. I am cowries Mantra man, what exactly did you see in this other existence, (please describe) did you see any other beings, if so, do you remember how they looked? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
galaxy Posted July 17, 2004 Report Share Posted July 17, 2004 lol...cowries, I meant curious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
galaxy Posted July 17, 2004 Report Share Posted July 17, 2004 Irish Eyes, I am also a Christian, "trying" to follow the right path. I liked when you mentioned you live your life to glorify God. That is something I am working on, even do for me is extremely hard. A book that is helping me a lot is The Purpose Driven Life by Rick Warren. It's a 40 day journey on living a godly life and finding out what your purpose in life is. It's helping me a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Martin Posted July 17, 2004 Report Share Posted July 17, 2004 Originally posted by: galaxyI also believe in the possibility of life after death in the physical.There is no evidence to support this. Why do you accept it as real? I know that there is a reason for our existence on earth, we might have a mission, or it may be simply a test of how much we can endure and what we did with our talents...Well,... do you know or is it "might"? If it is a test, who is testing us? If you know we exist for a reason please tell us all about it. This is HUGE. Information of this magnitude must be shared. ....we cannot rule any possibilities just for the simple fact that man has not found a scientific evidence...yet. If humans were always close minded we would still believe that the earth is flat ... there probably wouldn't be any continent called "America" and history itself would have been totally different.This I partly agree with. The quest for knowledge is in our nature. Some things have such an infinitely low probability that we could for convenience call them impossible however. Freethinker can explain this much better than I, so I'll leave it for now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
galaxy Posted July 18, 2004 Report Share Posted July 18, 2004 Well, as I mentioned before I am a Christian, and I get my faith from the bible, although this to you might not sound like "facts" ... What about the string theory? There might be a dimension that we cannot physically see, however, it does not mean is not there. What if we become part of that dimension after death? There is a possibility our creator would be there. I guess nobody will '"really'' know what happens after death until we get there, but personally I rather live by faith than rule out any possibilities of eternal life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Martin Posted July 18, 2004 Report Share Posted July 18, 2004 Originally posted by: galaxyWell, as I mentioned before I am a Christian,Why would you prescribe to an organization that has been historically one the the most destructive and harmful plagues to exist? You could remain spiritual without the dogma of organized religion. You could also accept that there is much we don't know. Which is the more reasonable path? and I get my faith from the bible, although this to you might not sound like "facts" ...Do you mean to say that you have faith in the bible? RE; Webster, "Faith- Belief without need of certain proof". You have the right to blindly accept the words of the most contradictory book ever written. I don't understand why any intelligent person would do this, it appears however that they do. Any faith you have comes from within you, you get nothing but mythological drivel from the bible.What about the string theory?I think attaching "theory" to this hypothesis is premature. It is an interesting field of study, and appears to have potential. There might be a dimension that we cannot physically see, however, it does not mean is not there.Yes. This is a valid statement. What if we become part of that dimension after death? There is a possibility our creator would be there.Now you are assuming things that have ZERO evidence to support them. Until there is some objective evidence, there is no afterlife and no creator. I guess nobody will '"really'' know what happens after death until we get there,Well, if you're wrong, when you die you'll never know you were wrong. If I'm wrong, ......wait,...no,.. that has never happened. but personally I rather live by faith than rule out any possibilities of eternal life.Explain this eternal life please. All you believers use this term to express the future, just where were you in the eternal past? Doesn't eternal encompass all of time? Where were you before you were born? All this religion really makes things more complicated than they need to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freethinker Posted July 20, 2004 Report Share Posted July 20, 2004 Originally posted by: galaxyI also believe in the possibility of life after death in the physical.Well it is always said that anything is possible. So yes, I would guess I ahve to agree. But the probability is a whole other thing. As much as one might WISH things like this to be true, one has to stop lying to oneself at a point. And that is exactly what someone is doing when they refuse to accept factual information and use logic and reason to evaluate things. So while you may WISH there was a life after death, and we can agree that there is some, althoiugh extremely slight, chance there is one, the probablity makes it such as it to require one to lie to themselves to continue to hold a beleif in it. I know that there is a reason for our existence on earth, we might have a mission, or it may be simply a test of how much we can endure and what we did with our talents (many of you guys have many) to contribute with humanity.Interesting. Here I would strongly agree! We can do no better with our lives than to put all of our efforts into that which most positively benefits HUMANITY! I am glad to meet another Secular Humanist here! You provide a very good description of it. Yes, we SH'ers use our live's work to advance Humanity rather than pretend there is benefit to obsequious suplication to some mythical sky monster that's just waiting to punish us at it first opportunity. Or to torture us in this life as some supposed cruel surival test. It amazes me how anyone would even want to pretned to worship such a monster. But I digress... we cannot rule any possibilities just for the simple fact that man has not found a scientific evidence...yet.But then we could never tell our children that there is no Santa Claus, Tooth Fairy, Easter Bunny, Jesus of the bible, and other myths and fairytales. They need to learn to accept reality sometime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freethinker Posted July 20, 2004 Report Share Posted July 20, 2004 Originally posted by: galaxyIrish Eyes, I am also a Christian, ??? But you just said your main thing was: to contribute with humanityNow you say it is rto surrender your mental capacities to antiquated supersitions over fact and reason! "trying" to follow the right path.Oh and he is just waiting, one wrong thought and BANG your toast for eternity! Yep that loving god monster of yours! No wonder your so distressed about it! And "trying" is the right word. No two of you Christians can agree on what IS the "right path". In fact you have killed each other (and everyone else) off for millenia at the slightest disagreement about it! I liked when you mentioned you live your life to glorify God.A true waste of a human life. You said it yourself originally that it is best: to contribute with humanityrather than waste your life following invented "revelations" that promote ignorance, hate and killing. That is something I am working on, even do for me is extremely hard.Actually with all the contradictions in the bible, it is IMPOSSIBLE. THat is part of the trick! They've got you no matter what! Keep that fear alive no matter what you decide! A book that is helping me a lot is The Purpose Driven Life by Rick Warren. It's a 40 day journey on living a godly life and finding out what your purpose in life is. It's helping me a lot.Ya and then it becomes day 41! Then you need to buy another book to TELL you what to believe! Oh but I thought the bible had it ALL! Now you put this book above it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freethinker Posted July 20, 2004 Report Share Posted July 20, 2004 Originally posted by: galaxyWell, as I mentioned before I am a Christian, and I get my faith from the bible, although this to you might not sound like "facts" ...No, I can understand you thinking you are getting your "faith" from the bible is a FACT. The problem is the bible is not a very factual source. What about the string theory? There might be a dimension that we cannot physically see, however, it does not mean is not there.Have you seen the Tooth Fairy yet? NO? Well then it must also be there! This is an example of a person lying to themselves by not using reasoning and logic Thi is the fallacy of argumentum ad ignorantiam. Argumentum ad ignorantiam means "argument from ignorance". This fallacy occurs whenever it is argued that something must be true simply because it has not been proved false. n scientific investigation if it is known that an event would produce certain evidence of its having occurred, the absence of such evidence can validly be used to infer that the event did not occur. In science, we can validly assume from lack of evidence that something has not occurred.What if we become part of that dimension after death? There is a possibility our creator would be there. I guess nobody will '"really'' know what happens after death until we get there, but personally I rather live by faith than rule out any possibilities of eternal life.I would rather do what you originally suggested! I would rather live the only life we KNOW we have to the greatest benefit of HUMANITY, rather than waste it trying to con some sky god into not torturing us forever! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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