Ideas Concerning Space Travel At High Speed.

[Darky]

Hi,

 

Space travel has become an issue for almost everybody and everything except light. Anything with mass can't travel at the speed of light, what's the closest thing to that speed?

 

Speed of Light : 299,792,458 m/s (No acceleration/de-acceleration).

 

Show your ideas here and possible ways to make them a reality by providing facts along with relatable theories.

 

Opinions are allowed (as this is an ideas topic), however, at certain regulations:

- Must be concerning the topic

- Supported by at least a theory of some sort.

 

Please follow these regulations as we don't want useless replies up in here.

 

Useful threads and posts relating to this topic (Approved my me):

》http://www.scienceforums.com/topic/29330-superintelligent-extraterrestrial-life-accelerated-evolution-and-the-fate-of-the-universe/?p=346296 - Thread 29330 at post 161

 

To infinity and beyond.

 

Edited April 22, 2017 by Darky

[Darky]

Hi,

 

Just a friendly reminder, the New Horizon has the record for the fastest exit out of the lunar orbit (9 hours after the launch - approximately at a Earth-relative speed of about 16.26 km/s. That said, Voyager 1 having a slower exit still is leaving the solar system faster due to gravity assists causing it to go at an approximate speed of 17.027 km/s relative to the sun (27.219 km/s relative to earth) (Source).

 

It seems to be that gravity assists seem to be the fastest way to gain speed.

 

What possible ideas can be further develop from this?

Edited April 22, 2017 by Darky

[A-wal]

First of all velocity is a meaningless concept in and of itself. Velocity relative to what? What space travel is really about is acceleration.

 

Ion beam propulsion, solar sailing and hydrogen scoping are the three ideas I know of that are theoretically plausible. I could imagine a craft that uses all three getting some mighty acceleration.

 

Hyper space is a purely theoretical way to cheat the speed of light by shortening the distance between two points but I have no idea how you could go about doing that even if higher dimensions do exist.

[Darky]

First of all velocity is a meaningless concept in and of itself. Velocity relative to what? What space travel is really about is acceleration.

 

Ion beam propulsion, solar sailing and hydrogen scoping are the three ideas I know of that are theoretically plausible. I could imagine a craft that uses all three getting some mighty acceleration.

 

Hyper space is a purely theoretical way to cheat the speed of light by shortening the distance between two points but I have no idea how you could go about doing that even if higher dimensions do exist.

Hi,

 

Thanks for giving your idea, truly appreciated.

 

First of all, I'll explain the Hyper space. It's done by shrinking the space behind you and making the space infront of you larger (has been done, if necessary I'll find you proof). This requires a huge amount of dark-matter (technically, 73% of space is made up of dark matter yet it's hardly noticeable).

 

Acceleration, huh? Clever idea but you're going star wars/star trek on me there. I'm afraid that's only possible if you are able to use Hyper space. If you know another way, let me know (I may and possibly am wrong). Also, if you're accelerated, de-acceleration is the issue; how do you propose we de-accelerate? Lets discuss.

 

I'm glad you gave in your theories!

[A-wal]

I meant hydrogen scooping.

 

What your talking about isn't really hyperspace, it's a 'warp drive'. I also have no idea how you'd go about warping spacetime like that. Dark matter is a purely hypothetical ad hoc addition to a broken model in a lame attempt to validate it. Even if there were such a thing, I don't think it would be well suited to the task of fueling an engine. Anti-matter is the best fuel.

 

Hyperspace is different. Take a flat two dimensional piece of paper and draw a a one cm line from one side to the other. How can you do that? Fold the paper. You've just decreased the distance by adding a dimension. That's what hyperspace is using an extra fourth spacial dimension.

 

Deceleration is acceleration, just in the opposite direction. There's really no such thing as deceleration. Think of a plane that sticks its engines in reverse to 'decelerate'. All it's doing is accelerating backwards.

Edited April 22, 2017 by A-wal

[Darky]

I meant hydrogen scooping.

 

What your talking about isn't really hyperspace, it's a 'warp drive'. I also have no idea how you'd go about warping spacetime like that. Dark matter is a purely hypothetical ad hoc addition to a broken model in a lame attempt to validate it. Even if there were such a thing, I don't think it would be well suited to the task of fueling an engine. Anti-matter is the best fuel.

 

Hyperspace is different. Take a flat two dimensional piece of paper and draw a a one cm line from one side to the other. How can you do that? Fold the paper. You've just decreased the distance by adding a dimension. That's what hyperspace is using an extra fourth spacial dimension.

 

Deceleration is acceleration, just in the opposite direction. There's really no such thing as deceleration. Think of a plane that sticks its engines in reverse to 'decelerate'. All it's doing is accelerating backwards.

Hi,

 

I see what you mean by hyperspace (caused by a wormwhole). I suspect you know the create two points, measure distance, fold paper, create a whole rendering distance to absolute zero theory. This is purely theoretical and never been done. If it should be possible, it would require a species having full control over space and already being able to travel at the speed of light and faster. No such species is discovered.

 

So you propose you decelerate by using the same amount of force on the opposite side. Not a bad idea except if the engines point in the exact opposite direction, they could collapse the whole ship. Two same opposite forces applying at the object in the middle could stop the object but in the process, crush it. We need a better solution.

[Super Polymath]

 

 

First of all velocity is a meaningless concept in and of itself. Velocity relative to what? What space travel is really about is acceleration.

 

Ion beam propulsion, solar sailing and hydrogen scoping are the three ideas I know of that are theoretically plausible. I could imagine a craft that uses all three getting some mighty acceleration.

 

Hyper space is a purely theoretical way to cheat the speed of light by shortening the distance between two points but I have no idea how you could go about doing that even if higher dimensions do exist.

An issue just as impeding as time is resources and an inability to communicate over interstellar distances. AI and autonomous self-assembly/replication actually overcomes both of those issues. Nanotech gives us this ability, or would give us this ability. Actually such Von Neumann probes overcome the only issues if your society is entirely robotic. 

 

Anyway my 11 page topic covers all this and more. 

Edited April 22, 2017 by Super Polymath

[Darky]

An issue just as impeding as time is resources and an inability to communicate over interstellar distances. AI and autonomous self-assembly/replication actually overcomes both of those issues. Nanotech gives us this ability, or would give us this ability. Actually such Von Neumann probes overcome the only issues if your society is entirely robotic.

 

Anyway my 11 page topic covers all this and more.

 

Hi,

 

That's correct for long-distance travels, however, a start can be made. Let's consider getting from earth to the moon in a minute? Seems like a possibility?

 

Also, your 11 page is purely theoretical. If it is supported by facts, I'll put a link to it in my topic but as it seems, it's not.

Edited April 22, 2017 by Darky

[Super Polymath]

That's correct for long-distance travels, however, a start can be made. Let's consider getting from earth to the moon in a minute? Seems like a possibility?

I thought we were avoiding theoretical ideas. 

 

If not, post #161 of thread #29330, possibly?

[Darky]

I thought we were avoiding theoretical ideas. 

 

If not, post #161 of thread #29330, possibly?

Hi,

 

We aren't avoiding theoractical ideas but only those which can be related to something fictional. I'll check #161.

[Darky]

Hi Super Polymath,

 

POST #161 from thread #29330 has been accepted. Linking it in the topic.

 

Thanks.

[Super Polymath]

Let's consider getting from earth to the moon in a minute? 

If you're talking about our fastest models for futuristic fusion powered Ion Drives, they clock in about .20 x C. Earth to the moon in a minute = approx. .32 x C.

 

Still waiting to hear back from CraigD about how fast my OMG particle beam powered electric sail would go. That's the only thing I could think of that might mathematically beat fusion powered ion drives. It would also be more expensive, as opposed to a stable fusion reactor you'd need a super particle accelerator network of atom smashers and particle focusers that would bankrupt the world. 

Edited April 22, 2017 by Super Polymath

[Darky]

If you're talking about our fastest models for futuristic fusion powered Ion Drives, they clock in about .20 x C. Earth to the moon in a minute = approx. .32 x C.

 

Still waiting to hear back from CraigD about how fast my OMG particle beam powered electric sail would go. That's the only thing I could think of that might mathematically beat fusion powered ion drives. It would also be more expensive, as opposed to a stable fusion reactor you'd need a super particle accelerator network of atom smashers and particle focusers that would bankrupt the world.

 

Hi,

 

Please provide proof, as nothing with mass moves that fast. If it's a theory, state so.

 

Mach 50 = 17014.3424 m/s

 

0.2 x C = 59,958,491.6 m/s - an entirely different state.

 

Speed of the fastest man made object (Voyager 1) : 7.56083333 m/s

 

I'll need proof for this.

[Super Polymath]

If it's a theory, state so.

Lol, excuse me for assuming that by typing "fusion reactors" you'd know that this is futuristic. We haven't been able to sustain a stable fusion reaction yet. 

Hi,

 

Please provide proof, as nothing with mass moves that fast.

Protons move that fast, photons have mass and it's a theory that gravity effects light differently depending on it's wavelength. That is called rainbow gravity, an alternative to the big bang theory. 

[Darky]

Protons move that fast, photons have mass and it's a theory that gravity effects light differently depending on it's wavelength. That is called rainbow gravity, an alternative to the big bang theory.

 

Hi

 

Photons don't have 'mass'. They travel at C.

[Super Polymath]

Hi

 

Photons don't have 'mass'. They travel at C.

That's a figure of speech.

 

We haven't actually proven that.

 

Anyway C is a mathematical constant, not a photon:

 

Edited April 22, 2017 by Super Polymath

[A-wal]

I see what you mean by hyperspace (caused by a wormwhole). I suspect you know the create two points, measure distance, fold paper, create a whole rendering distance to absolute zero theory. This is purely theoretical and never been done. If it should be possible, it would require a species having full control over space and already being able to travel at the speed of light and faster. No such species is discovered.

A wormhole is something else. It doesn't require extra dimensions but I'm not sure how they're supposed to be able to do what's claimed. Yes, both hyperspace and wormholes are purely theoretical.

 

So you propose you decelerate by using the same amount of force on the opposite side. Not a bad idea except if the engines point in the exact opposite direction, they could collapse the whole ship. Two same opposite forces applying at the object in the middle could stop the object but in the process, crush it. We need a better solution.

You misunderstand. There wouldn't be the same amount of force on opposite sides, that would cause no overall acceleration.

 

Once an object stops accelerating, it's inertial (at rest). Acceleration is the ONLY way to decelerate.

 

Deceleration is simply acceleration in the opposite of an arbitrary direction.