Ideal Man

[petrushkagoogol]

Is there anything like the ideal man or is it a myth ?

[Moontanman]

Is there anything like the ideal man or is it a myth ?

 

 

I would say that the ideal man is to subjective to be meaningful. 

[Super Polymath]

I would say that the ideal man is to subjective to be meaningful. 

They say life is easier when you have enough bling bling $ dough to throw at any problem you're facing. 

 

So I'd say I would be ideal if I were rich.

 

You know, bodybuilding is one example. Nutrition and 8 hours consistent sleep same time every night and micro-trauma 7 days a week from minimal trips the gym about 3 days a week (soreness lasts longer if you bust your *** for 3 hours and hit the muscle group with a different movement or lift each time).

 

I mean, think about how complicated getting ripped is. Even you if you just hit the gym everyday to substitute for non-precise nutrition and imperfect circadian rhythms for sleep recovery and a lack of testosterone, if you lift too much fatigue poison build-up will cause muscular and mental fatigue up the wazoo making it impossible to get ripped. Easy af to become anorexic (using the concentration camp diet), when you're anorexic it's easier enough to gain fat (insulin resistance by having halloween everyday so that you don't get full and can expand that stomach). But getting ripped (toned muscles) is next to impossible for the working class. I don't care if you take enough zinc and sleep enough to have 3100+ T you still won't just automatically be ripped. 

 

If you have MONEY, however, you don't have to work and you have plenty of time and resources to get the job of getting ripped done with precise nutrition, sleep for your testosterone, and dynamic tension and variety in your lifts. Or you could just shoot adipotide and follistatin into your veins and spinal column twice a day and be a ripped couch potato. 

 

Education is another example. If you have infinite money you can just pay for michio kaku to tutor you as you pay your way through Harvard University while popping a smorgasbord of nootropics and sleeping 12 hours a night to improve your memory. 

 

Being rich makes the ideal man, because wealth buys opportunity. Opportunity for productivity, for utility, for love. 

 

The individuals who are ideal to the populace are celebrities and all celebrities have one thing in common, a boat-load of money. Before becoming a ripped man with a college degree Brad Pitt was an anorexic 26 year-old cab driver and a college drop-out. 

 

If you're looking at natural intellect as the key factor and want to exclude accomplishments, intelligence has no meaning other than criteria, even in IQ tests. Unless a person is just born with a larger prefrontal cortex than average -  that will grantee that he is born smarter in the academic because he's more analytical in his thought process. I mean, genetics can be altered with RnA injections like the aforementioned adipotide and follistatin - but those substances will kill you before they even take effect on your genetic code. Being a genius (having a larger prefrontal cortex as seen in ASDs and sudden savant syndrome) is hereditary and nothing can make you smarter on the genetic level. So you're either born with a better memory or you're not.

 

In summary, if wealth disparity isn't a factor here, genetics define the ideal man for any criterion you chose.

 

Or maybe we're not looking at it from what someone can do mentally or physically. Maybe by ideal man the opening poster meant as a partner in a relationship, and then you're right, it's absolutely meaningless, total chaos, because anyone can fall in love with anyone.

 

Personality is a delusion, personality is behavioral patterns that form based on role models and don't really mean anything. A man and a woman can have compatible personalities and due to circumstance hate each other's guts. Falling in love is a crap-shoot. 

 

My problem is that me pervasive developmental disorder has effected the forming of my personality, and continues to, to the point where forming any personality is a fruitless endeavor. I'm the kind of guy that you can know all your life and never be able to tell what he's going to do next. He could rob a bank for all you know. 

Edited March 3, 2016 by Super Polymath

[Maine farmer]

"Ideal" depends on your values.  

 

They say life is easier when you have enough bling bling $ dough to throw at any problem you're facing. 

 

So I'd say I would be ideal if I were rich.

 

You know, bodybuilding is one example. Nutrition and 8 hours consistent sleep same time every night and micro-trauma 7 days a week from minimal trips the gym about 3 days a week (soreness lasts longer if you bust your *** for 3 hours and hit the muscle group with a different movement or lift each time).

 

I mean, think about how complicated getting ripped is. Even you if you just hit the gym everyday to substitute for non-precise nutrition and imperfect circadian rhythms for sleep recovery and a lack of testosterone, if you lift too much fatigue poison build-up will cause muscular and mental fatigue up the wazoo making it impossible to get ripped. Easy af to become anorexic (using the concentration camp diet), when you're anorexic it's easier enough to gain fat (insulin resistance by having halloween everyday so that you don't get full and can expand that stomach). But getting ripped (toned muscles) is next to impossible for the working class. I don't care if you take enough zinc and sleep enough to have 3100+ T you still won't just automatically be ripped. 

 

If you have MONEY, however, you don't have to work and you have plenty of time and resources to get the job of getting ripped done with precise nutrition, sleep for your testosterone, and dynamic tension and variety in your lifts. Or you could just shoot adipotide and follistatin into your veins and spinal column twice a day and be a ripped couch potato. 

 

Education is another example. If you have infinite money you can just pay for michio kaku to tutor you as you pay your way through Harvard University while popping a smorgasbord of nootropics and sleeping 12 hours a night to improve your memory. 

 

Being rich makes the ideal man. 

The body building example is all about appearances.  I have come across many men who were "ripped" that couldn't keep up with me with my extra pounds around my midsection.  

 

As for the education, I have come across many educated people who don't know how to apply their knowledge to solving problems.  Knowledge is not a vaccine against stupidity.

 

Being rich can be a fleeting state of existence without the wisdom to manage the wealth.

[Super Polymath]

"Ideal" depends on your values.  

So moral sameness?

 

That's called dogmatic indoctrination. We're all victims of our dogma and of the indoctrination by our role models. 

 

There is no moral truth. I am a marxist. You tell me to think a certain way and I'll go on thinking the way I think. I could care less about anyone's morality. I'm actually working on becoming non-moral, looking at my own values and interests as chaotic and meaningless, as they are, on the largest level in the grand scheme of things. I look at my free-will as an illusion... 

 

"Why get up, why keep fighting? Do you believe you're fighting for something? {..anything...}Concepts of a feeble human intellect trying desperately to justify an existence that is without meaning or purpose...why do you persist?"

 

"Because I choose to."

 

-The Matrix

 

I have come across many men who were "ripped" that couldn't keep up with me with my extra pounds around my midsection.  

 

That's because they probably haven't done what ever it is you were doing in your competition as much as you have.

 

 

 

As for the education, I have come across many educated people who don't know how to apply their knowledge to solving problems.  Knowledge is not a vaccine against stupidity.

 

That's all dependent on criteria. 

 

 

 

Being rich can be a fleeting state of existence without the wisdom to manage the wealth.

 

There actually is a quantifiable relationship between purchasing power and well-being, and the opportunity to do things that wealth affords. 

 

There's an interesting notion that the most evil is committed by those with an intention to do good. So perhaps, in some ways, we need to stop worrying about others and start worrying about ourselves. 

 

Apathy, now that's a crucial virtue. At some point, everyone is apathetic. If we can control what we're apathetic to, it could improve our experience. In my mind, the goal of life should be to maximize hedonic capital, the notion of spending our attention on that which serves our own personal needs and interests the best. 

 

Alan Moore asserted this much in his Watchmen novel with the characters of Ozymandias and Doctor Manhattan.

 

Although Alan Moore has changed his tone as of late, saying that he wrote that in a dark time of his life (lol, welcome to my world Alan Moore), but he was right and his message was brilliant. Ozymandias committed atrocities for the greater good, killing millions and millions of innocent men women and children, saving the human race. And who's to say he wasn't a savior? This is what any vigilante becomes, an agent of evil, a criminal. Doctor Manhattan saw that the only way to protect the human race was to abandon it. 

Edited March 3, 2016 by Super Polymath

[Maine farmer]

 

. In my mind, the goal of life should be to maximize hedonic capital, the notion of spending our attention on that which serves our own personal needs and interests the best. 

 

That looks like a libertarian principle to me. (Nothing wrong with that)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

There actually is a quantifiable relationship between purchasing power and well-being, and the opportunity to do things that wealth affords. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Perhaps, but  a careless use of wealth will lead to a lack of wealth eventually .

 

So moral sameness?

 

 

Not at all.  "Ideal " will vary from culture to culture and individual to individual.  We all have our preferences.  

[Super Polymath]

Perhaps, but  a careless use of wealth will lead to a lack of wealth eventually .

 

That would depend on the amount of wealth one begins with. ;) Hint:You don't need to have wealth to use it. 

 

 

Not at all.  "Ideal " will vary from culture to culture and individual to individual.  We all have our preferences.  

Those aren't our true preferences considering most of the world's populace does not operate on hedonic capital, but rather is the result of conformity, these individual preferences aren't genuine. People band-wagon out of fear and desperation, becoming apart of another's cause. Such preferences should not be treated as anything more than a diluted thought process, a disillusioned belief system, an illusion. 

 

In slang terms, if everyone were a "real-ngga", we'd be living in a perfect world and you would be right. 

 

Alas, we are to value moral differences - because if we value moral similarity, desperation for conformity will lead us to becoming a force of oppression. 

Edited March 3, 2016 by Super Polymath

[Super Polymath]

The ideal man uses the world around him to chase his own personal needs and interests.

 

I choose to believe that the world around is apart of an infinite existence - and that there's plenty for all of us and if everyone chased their own personal agendas, without letting anyone else or any concept reshape said agendas, the world would be a perfect place for everyone. 

 

Mirror mirror on the wall, who's the realest ngga of them all?

 

I am. 100!

Edited March 3, 2016 by Super Polymath

[Maine farmer]

The ideal man uses the world around him to chase his own personal needs and interests.

 

I choose to believe that the world around is apart of an infinite existence - and that there's plenty for all of us and if everyone chased their own personal agendas, without letting anyone else or any concept reshape said agendas, the world would be a perfect place for everyone. 

 

Mirror mirror on the wall, who's the realest ngga of them all?

 

I am. 100!

What of the man who's own personal needs interests include telling others what to do?  Many problems can be caused by such a man.

 

As for me, if I were to acquire unlimited wealth, I would build a metal shop, a wood shop, and a laboratory and spend most of my time tinkering and fabricating and looking for new problems to work on.  Is my desire to create things and take on challenges, and the soothing sensation I get while welding all just a result of culturally imposed preferences ?

[Super Polymath]

What of the man who's own personal needs interests include telling others what to do?  Many problems can be caused by such a man.

 

Some people like to be used, and usually people use each other and don't mind because they're both getting their way. 

 

As for me, if I were to acquire unlimited wealth, I would build a metal shop, a wood shop, and a laboratory and spend most of my time tinkering and fabricating and looking for new problems to work on.  Is my desire to create things and take on challenges, and the soothing sensation I get while welding all just a result of culturally imposed preferences ?

 

Whatever influenced you in the past is irrelevant as long as that cycle of influence is currently beginning and ending with what you think is right.

 

The values of others does not have to be the same as yours in order for you to desire them in your life or use them to advance your own agenda, if it's your agenda and you believe it's right and it makes you happy. 

 

I believe in win-win situations. Freeing your mind is a matter of taking any risk and doing anything necessary to get your way until it works and you get your way. Then you move onto the next thing. You can't fight the current but you can find a current that suits you. 

Edited March 4, 2016 by Super Polymath

[CraigD]

Is there anything like the ideal man or is it a myth ?

I would say that the ideal man is to subjective to be meaningful.

"Ideal" depends on your values.

I agree.

 

Put another way, we can say that when used as an adjective, ideal means that the thing it modifies (eg: ideal human, ideal gas) exemplifies a principle. Used as a noun, an ideal is a principle, the old Platonic idea of forms, implied that ideals are absolute, more real than the physical thing that exemplify them. More modern philosophers consider ideals as socially relative, and thus changeable and arising from our perception of physical things and their effects. So an ideal person in one society, or subsegment of a society would not be ideal in another, or the ideal person in a society at a given time would not be ideal later. The adjective “ideal” is a close synonym of “perfect”. Like beauty, we can say “perfection is in the eye of the beholder”.

 

Rolling back the modern acceptance of social relativism to get back to Plato’s perfect forms has an enticing beauty, and is, I think, a worthwhile philosophical pursuit. With Aristotelian forms, one assumes each exists in an unchanging, more-real-than-physical sense, which, rather than inventing as we do a modern ideal, we attempt to discover. The ideal person, then, requires us to contemplate not so much what a person should do or avoid – in philosophical terms, morality – but what a person really is – ontology.

 

So let’s move from “is there anything like the ideal person?” past the primarily moral question “what is the ideal person?” to the ontological questions “what is a person?”

 

This question opens onto a vast philosophical domain, so I’ll just throw out my opinion, starting with a famous opinion from Robert A Heinlein:

"A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects."

 

My opinion goes further than this, with a qualification that makes it actually achievable: a human being should be able to learn to do anything. It’s not the lack of specialization that make a human, but practically unlimited adaptability.