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#1 cyberlolz

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Posted 06 June 2008 - 04:43 AM

Hi , can someone please help me in finding a university IN melbourne that hosts a course for "bachelor of forensic science" to be specific – chemistry

And if possible could you please give me a website or tell me the minimum VCE enter score needed to get in to studying this at any univesity in melbourne i really need to know because im am thinking of studying forensic science in the future after completing my VCE at the same time being afraid of how well i do
these are the subjects i intend in doing :
Biology
chemistry
Maths methods
English
Japanese
Specialist
P.S i would also like to know the prerequisites to get into forensic science(how am i meant to kno the prerequissites for 2010, because that is when i do year 12) // also the way vce works.
Thanks Heaps
Thanks Heaps

#2 Monomer

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Posted 06 June 2008 - 04:55 PM

Since you're interested in forensic science then here's a good opportunity to develop some investigation skills.

Google is your friend. Do a search for a list of the universities in Melbourne and then see which one offers the course you want. Or you can do a search for "forensic science course in Melbourne".

As for the minimum VCE entrance score needed, check out the VTAC website. Search for the course you're after and it should give you the prerequisite subjects and scores required. If you have any questions then perhaps contact VTAC or speak to your science teachers or career counsellor if you have one.

#3 cyberlolz

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Posted 07 June 2008 - 01:25 AM

How much do forensic scientists get paid in Victoria??

#4 Monomer

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Posted 07 June 2008 - 03:52 AM

I don't exactly know how much Forensic Scientists earn, but you'll perhaps start at somewhere between $30,000 and $40,000 a year when you first enter the field. With further qualifications and experience you'll earn more.

Also, if you want more info on forensic science check out the Job Guide online and the National Institute of Forensic Science Australia:

Job Guide 2008
Welcome to NIFS, the National Institute of Forensic Science

#5 cyberlolz

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Posted 07 June 2008 - 04:23 AM

thank u so much for your replies they helped me alot but 30 - 40 thousand a year is umm .. pretty low and does more qualification mean the more courses studied at university ?
if so where can i find the courses needed for me to study and i am also having trouble finding the VCE enter score needed to get into forensic science. i searched a few sites and they say in the 50 %'s and i really am feeling repelled form studying this because of- low pay
- and such a low enter score whcih may mean not such an important job after all.. in addition to alot of negative comments

#6 freeztar

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Posted 07 June 2008 - 08:44 AM

thank u so much for your replies they helped me alot but 30 - 40 thousand a year is umm .. pretty low and does more qualification mean the more courses studied at university ?
if so where can i find the courses needed for me to study and i am also having trouble finding the VCE enter score needed to get into forensic science. i searched a few sites and they say in the 50 %'s and i really am feeling repelled form studying this because of- low pay
- and such a low enter score whcih may mean not such an important job after all.. in addition to alot of negative comments


I would suggest that you do more research. Monomer said "perhaps" you would start at $30k-$40k. Do some fact checking. :jab:
At least here in the US, you will make more money if you have higher level degrees. Getting a bachelor degree can get you the job, but if you have a master's degree, you will get paid quite a bit more.

Science is usually not a field where people live luxurious lifestyles because of high salaries. As an ecologist, I have a very modest lifestyle (relatively). But the fact that I love my work brings me much more happiness than money ever could. :)

It's also worth noting that you're options are *wide* open! I started college as a philosophy major, then changed to botany, before finally settling on ecology. In early high school, I was certain that I was going to become an electrical engineer. Things change. :)

#7 Monomer

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Posted 07 June 2008 - 11:05 PM

If you want a job where you earn heaps of money in your first years out of uni then I suggest you go into engineering or law. They're the jobs that'll pay the decent salaries. Study finance or economics instead and become an investment banker.

But if you actually want to be a forensic scientist because that's where your interest lies then persue that line of work regardless of the salary. Like freeztar posted, your love of your job will bring your much more happiness and satisfaction. Don't expect to get paid $60,000 or $70,000 a year when you're fresh out of uni with a bit of knowledge and hardly any experience (foresnsic or life). You'll work your way up to that salary if you're willing to put in the effort. Doing a PhD will increase your salary, but from what I've noticed with my friends who have PhDs, those higher qualifications make it a lot more difficult to get a job.

I found this in a Deakin University brochure:

Prerequisites: VCE units 3 and 4 – a study score of at least 20 in English (any), chemistry and mathematics (any).


http://www.deakin.ed...ide/science.pdf

Now, I'm not sure what a study score is because I've been out of school for a while, but your teachers will be able to explain this.

The Edith Cowan University listed a TER of 60 for forensic science. Just because it seems like a low entrance score doesn't mean the course will be easy. When I got into a Bachelor of Science some years ago the entrance score was 80 out of 100 (it had dropped from 88 the year before). That was kind of low compared to many of the other courses, but damn the course was hard work. Unless you're a science wizz I think you'll find the course challenging. But if you're worried about the low entrance score and low pay then pick something else to do.

#8 cyberlolz

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Posted 10 June 2008 - 03:02 AM

Say, i have another question , what is the job name for Computer Forensics because the 2008 Australian job guide does not have the name "computer forensics

#9 Monomer

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Posted 10 June 2008 - 04:20 AM

I think it's Computer Forensics, but I don't think the job guide is a completely comprehensive list of jobs. Computer Forensics is a branch of forensic science and it would be something you specialise in once you've completed the forensic science course.

The Melbourne University offers a graduate certificate in Digital Forensics and one of the subjects is computer forensics.
Melbourne University - SoE Digital Forensics

#10 cyberlolz

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Posted 10 June 2008 - 04:45 AM

So that means for example i want to do computer forensics
i have to complete a course for - Bachelor of Analytical chemistry, forensic science and medicine(VIC uni). After i finshed that i can choose to specialise. and then if i choose chemistry or computer or medicine.etc. - in this case computer, i hav to leave Vic uni and sign up for melb uni for this course {computer} .
After that if i want to complete a masters - do i complete a masters for computer or the base course (vic uni)

By the way if u can: can u explain masters, phd,, major, double major etc.. thanks alot

#11 cyberlolz

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Posted 10 June 2008 - 04:51 AM

And i for got sorry, if i were to complete a specialisation would i only be able to work as a computer forensic or can i work as a crime scene investigator like all other forensic scientists but still hold that qualification in hand. And apparently i cant find any master degrrees Also can u do 2 Bachelors degrees in university.

#12 cyberlolz

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Posted 10 June 2008 - 05:00 AM

So if i work for Compiuter forensics can i still hold that qualifications and work for crime scene investigators and in labs?? And I cant find any masters degree in forensic scinece in VICtoria . If i do , do i choose a masters degree for forensic science or computer forensic? thank You So so much

#13 Monomer

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Posted 10 June 2008 - 04:55 PM

So that means for example i want to do computer forensics
i have to complete a course for - Bachelor of Analytical chemistry, forensic science and medicine(VIC uni). After i finshed that i can choose to specialise. and then if i choose chemistry or computer or medicine.etc. - in this case computer, i hav to leave Vic uni and sign up for melb uni for this course {computer} .
After that if i want to complete a masters - do i complete a masters for computer or the base course (vic uni)

By the way if u can: can u explain masters, phd,, major, double major etc.. thanks alot


You would complete the Bachelor course at Vic Uni and then you would leave anyway because you've finished the studies. So then you go to Melbourne Uni to do the graduate certificate.

A masters degree is the next step up and mostly involves course work. It takes about a year or two to complete. A PhD is a level up from that and involves practical research work and takes about three years to complete. A major is the subject or area you choose to focus on in your final year(s) at uni. For example, I did a Bachelor of Science, and my major, or the subject I chose to focus on in my final year, was microbiology. A double major is when you focus on a couple of different areas. Many people do a double major in science and law.

Actually, give this a read:
http://www.raci.org....April2005p4.pdf

And i for got sorry, if i were to complete a specialisation would i only be able to work as a computer forensic or can i work as a crime scene investigator like all other forensic scientists but still hold that qualification in hand. And apparently i cant find any master degrrees Also can u do 2 Bachelors degrees in university.


If you specialise you aren't necessarily restricted to that area, but the longer you work in that area the more you'll forget or lose touch with the other areas of forensic science. But also you'll become such an expert in the area you've specialised in that people will require your services. If you want to specialise in computer forensics then you can work as a crime scene investigator when computers are involved.

You can certainly do two Bachelor degrees at uni, but it will probably take you five years to complete them.

Here is a list of courses related to forensic science, including Masters degrees, availabe in Victoria:
Courses and Programs—By State/Occupation


So if i work for Compiuter forensics can i still hold that qualifications and work for crime scene investigators and in labs?? And I cant find any masters degree in forensic scinece in VICtoria . If i do , do i choose a masters degree for forensic science or computer forensic? thank You So so much


You can certainly choose to work for crime scene investigators and in labs even if you have graduate qualifications in computer forensics. It would probably be a good idea to initially try it all to see what you like and are more suited to. Try not to limit yourself too early, but leave your options open. My advice would be to do as much work experience as you can and start doing that now. Get a feel for the job and find out what others have studied. Actually I can't stress the importance of work experience enough. It would really help you with your studies and it will give you the edge when you graduate and need a job. Make many contacts and show them that you're keen and a great worker.

#14 cyberlolz

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Posted 11 June 2008 - 01:35 AM

hmmm... yes but if i choose to study computer forensics does it mean i have to have some qualifications in computers already or can i have the base course from Vic uni on its own because i have realised dome universities require some knowledge / qualifications in computers and the internet.

________________________________________________________________
Since there are so many courses for forensic science and maybe even more in the future how do i know which course is best for me, i mean forensic science is 1 job but there are so many courses and due to this i am afraid that if i do 2 bachelor degrees ill repeat some of the work wasting some good opportunities.
________________________________________________________________
If u can , can you please find some double major courses in relation to and will be useful in becoming a forensic scientist.
_________________________________________________________________
I am also realising university hav diffrent pre requisites HowEver! The job guide has more for example
FORENSIC SCIENCE (job guide)
Prerequisites-> biology chemistry mathematical methods higher level maths English
Vic uni Bachelor of Science (Medical, Forensic and Analytical Chemistry)Prerequisites: Units 3 and 4-a study score of at least 20 in English (any) and in mathematics (any).
Middle-band: Completing any of biology, chemistry, and specialist mathematics = an aggregate 5 points higher per study. Completing physics, mathematical methods (either), literature, psychology or information technology (any) = an aggregate 3.5 points higher per study, to a maximum 10 points. Re-ranking also based on prerequisite studies and science (any).
(What is middle band)?

So overall why are they different because i really dislike the idea of biology in the job guide and don't know which to believe.

Thank you

Thank you for your help

#15 Monomer

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Posted 11 June 2008 - 03:41 AM

hmmm... yes but if i choose to study computer forensics does it mean i have to have some qualifications in computers already or can i have the base course from Vic uni on its own because i have realised dome universities require some knowledge / qualifications in computers and the internet.


I don't know if you would need to have qualifications in computing or whether that is covered in the course. You'll need to speak to someone at the uni about that, or maybe contact someone at the National Institute of Forensic Science.


Since there are so many courses for forensic science and maybe even more in the future how do i know which course is best for me, i mean forensic science is 1 job but there are so many courses and due to this i am afraid that if i do 2 bachelor degrees ill repeat some of the work wasting some good opportunities.

If u can , can you please find some double major courses in relation to and will be useful in becoming a forensic scientist.


You'll need to go through all the forensic science courses and see what they offer and pick the one you like. You've still got a couple of years before you need to apply for uni so you don't actually need to choose a course yet. Why do you need to get two bachelor degrees or why do you need a double major? If you're just interested in forensic science then just do a forensic science degree. If something else takes your fancy later on or if you want to specialise then do a graduate certificate/diploma.


I am also realising university hav diffrent pre requisites HowEver! The job guide has more for example
FORENSIC SCIENCE (job guide)
Prerequisites-> biology chemistry mathematical methods higher level maths English
Vic uni Bachelor of Science (Medical, Forensic and Analytical Chemistry)Prerequisites: Units 3 and 4-a study score of at least 20 in English (any) and in mathematics (any).
Middle-band: Completing any of biology, chemistry, and specialist mathematics = an aggregate 5 points higher per study. Completing physics, mathematical methods (either), literature, psychology or information technology (any) = an aggregate 3.5 points higher per study, to a maximum 10 points. Re-ranking also based on prerequisite studies and science (any).
(What is middle band)?

So overall why are they different because i really dislike the idea of biology in the job guide and don't know which to believe.


I don't know what the middle band is. School has changed a bit since I was there so talk to your teachers about that.

I believe that biology would be part of any forensic science course. You'll get some grounding in biology, chemistry, physics, among other areas, and then you'll specialise. So it would be a good idea to study biology at school so you're not lost when you get to uni.

#16 cyberlolz

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Posted 11 June 2008 - 04:43 AM

yes i know what you mean by "whats the point in doing 2 degrees" its so i can have a ground of my next priority if how ever they dont take me into forensics. And also, say if theres 10 courses and i pick the one i like , does this mean it will give me a disadvantage/ advantage towards my job as all 10 courses will get me in to forensic science but because of==>> "which course is more worth it " which is better" "which is more specific and detailed" -- things like that..
Say if the course i pick does not consist of biology or a very minimul amount of biology and the rest of the 9 courses which i didnt pick consists of alot of biology will that affect me in my field of work in the future? if not what do different courses mean in a university because if they all get you into the same job in the future why does it consists of "more of this and less of that" in comparison to the rest-- (also putting aside the reason to specialise later on).
Thank you so much

#17 Monomer

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Posted 11 June 2008 - 05:17 AM

Since I'm not in the forensic science field I don't know which course is better - that's something you're going to have to try to find out. Talk to forensic scientists and ask their opinion. Talk to the people who employ forensic scientists (perhaps your future employers) and ask what qualifications they expect applicants to have.

If you don't like biology then pick a course with little biology. It will not be a disadvantage to you because you can focus on chemistry or something else and be at an advantage for jobs requiring that knowledge. If you want to work in a particular area of forensic science that is biology based then pick a course with lots of focus on biology.

You'll need to think about what you want to do in forensic science and look at your strengths and weaknesses. Look at the courses that offer subjects that you're interested in and good at. But look beyond first year because during that initial year at uni you're going to get a grounding in a range of areas, including biology. In second year you can start to specialise so look at what the different courses offer and basically just pick what you like. Each uni offers what they can and the beauty of them all being different is that there's something for everyone. Sure you're all going to graduate as "forensic scientists" but each person will have a particular focus.

You can only make a wrong choice if you pick something you're not suited to. Seriously, just do something you enjoy; don't worry about picking the wrong course.