Heroism

[Cedars]

An interesting read on people who die saving others. The focus is on one particular person in one specific instance.

 

"Help us!" they screamed. "We're going to die out here!"

 

A chopper arrives and begins rescue ops.

 

The next person to receive the ring handed it over to someone else. The chopper lofted her to safety, then wheeled back.

 

The man gave away the ring again.

And again.

 

He even gave it away when he knew it was his last chance to live. He must have known, because when the chopper thundered back seconds later, he was gone. The man in the water had vanished beneath the ice.

 

Heroism is one of the last remaining riddles of human behavior. When it comes to root causes and rational explanations, heroism is as baffling as its evil twin, brutality. Actually, psychopaths are slightly more transparent than heroes; we've at least figured out that what makes a psychopath so dangerous is a psychological disconnect, a lack of caring for anyone but himself.

 

And so, after sifting through more than a century's worth of Carnegie case studies, three intriguing factors snap into focus.

 

1. Lots of guys are risking their lives: Since 1904 the Carnegie Commission has seen over 80,000 cases of extreme heroism.

 

2. Nine out of every 10 Carnegie heroes have been men.

 

3. Heroism is a lethal business; during a typical 5-year stretch, nearly one in four Carnegie Medals was bestowed upon a corpse.

 

Why, then, do so many of us gamble against such rotten odds?

 

The hidden cost of heroism

 

The section on page 4 called "What a hero leaves behind" is something not many of these types of stories covers.

 

Personally, I dont think I have what it takes to come thru in one of these kinds of moments. I have never come face to face with someone who is going to die without help, where an instant of action could change that outcome. And I havent been in a situation where there is some kind of life ring and a line of people waiting their/my turn. So I only can guess what I would do.

 

Having known people who work in rescue operations (emts, firemen, police, etc) they always stress not to put yourself in danger, they hate it when a situation turns into more people needing rescue than when 911 was dialed.

 

I think I would reason my way out of doing this kind of action, handing the life line off to someone else. Unless it was a kid. Or like a mother holding a baby/young kids. Not even reason my way out of it, most likely, it wouldnt occur to me to hand it off (except in the kid/mother/children case). If it was my turn for the life line, most likely, I would take it and deal with the survivor guilt later, when the stories of who died behind me come out and I second guess my actions.

 

Anyone else have thoughts on these kinds of stories and actions people take?

What do you think you would do?

[C1ay]

I have put myself in harm's way for the sake of others a couple of times. Each time I knew that I could live with any failure I might endure having the knowledge that I had at least tried to help them. I really can't bear the thought of watching harm come to someone and knowing I didn't try to do something about it. That would haunt me for the rest of my life.

[Cedars]

I have put myself in harm's way for the sake of others a couple of times. Each time I knew that I could live with any failure I might endure having the knowledge that I had at least tried to help them. I really can't bear the thought of watching harm come to someone and knowing I didn't try to do something about it. That would haunt me for the rest of my life.

 

Thats not exactly what I was going for. Putting yourself in harms way is different. Like the article covered, there were people on shore trying to help, one guy floated out and was nearly unconscious when dragged back to shore by others.

 

But thats different than being in that line for the ring being dangled down from the helicopter and giving the ring over to another, again and again. Being the last one out of a crash or the water when you dont have to be. Making that choice.

 

Like I said I can only guess what I would do under the extreme example. Like one of being in the WTC (where the hero example would be the people carrying wheelchairs down the stairs), on a falling bridge in Minneapolis (wherein the closest example of the same kind of hero would be the bus driver with the broken back), in a sinking plane on a frozen river. Equals in the extreme crash, but letting the others go first.

 

I've been in cold waters (no danger in that example but I do know cold water hurts just like described in titanic). I've been in a flaming car wreck. I know the panic I felt and yet in this example, I havent been in an extreme situation where a hero could emerge (all four of us got out ok, no one was trapped or injured greatly). The wreck just wasnt that extreme.

 

I am not trying to minimize the aid you have offered under these situations. Your a hero to those who you helped no doubt. The man who floated out into the cold water to try to help was one type of hero. I know the pain he endured in that cold water. He tried to help. But its still not the extreme of the man passing the life ring to every other stranger hanging on in that extreme condition.

 

I dont know that I would do it. Self survival and adrenaline would be so extreme that I am not sure that passing up my place in line would factor in. This is not to say I would fight for a better spot in that line. I think I would wait my turn. I dont think I would snatch the life ring from another.

[modest]

The next person to receive the ring handed it over to someone else. The chopper lofted her to safety, then wheeled back.

 

The man gave away the ring again.

And again.

 

I think you're talking about Air Florida Flight 90 and the passenger's name was Arland D. Williams Jr.

 

Often overlooked in the story is that Williams was pinned in the wreckage, unable (presumably) to be lifted out of the water. At least that's what the other survivors said. When the tail section sank further it took him with it. While he was definitely a hero that day, I'm not sure he consciously choose to give his life for another. He may have had no choice.

 

However, I believe there are cases where people do give that ultimate sacrifice and in some cases it is even a given. As the Titanic sank it was assumed by most everyone that women and children would be saved while the men died.

 

In the end it probably comes down to what a person is not willing to do to ensure their own survival rather than what they are willing to give up to save another.

Would you give your life to save another?

Or from another perspective:

Would you kill another to save yourself?

 

Then there is the case where person-A gives their own life to save person-B when person-A was in no danger to begin with. I imagine this would be very much more rare. The only example I can think of right now is the movie "John Q" where Denzel Washington is going to shoot himself in order to give his son his heart for transplant. I believe this kind of action is not common to the human condition. People don't intentionally kill themselves to save strangers unless both are in peril. Otherwise, "heroes" would be killing themselves left and right in order to give their liver or heart to strangers who are dying in hospitals.

 

In any case, how a person acts in any of these situations is probably unknown until tested.

 

-modest

[Freddy]

Someone long ago once said, "the greatest thing a person can do is lay his life down for another's." Who was that wise man?

[modest]

Someone long ago once said, "the greatest thing a person can do is lay his life down for another's." Who was that wise man?

 

No one said that.

 

There was a religious leader that said something about laying down your life for “friends” showing the greatest “love” - but that is different from what you put quotes around I would say. I would be willing to discuss him or it if you want to start a thread in the theology forum or PM me otherwise maybe not the best place

 

-modest

[Freddy]

No one said that.

 

There was a religious leader that said something about laying down your life for “friends” showing the greatest “love” - but that is different from what you put quotes around I would say. I would be willing to discuss him or it if you want to start a thread in the theology forum or PM me otherwise maybe not the best place :)

 

-modest

Here is the actual quote. How it is different in meaning from my version I fail to see. I believe many are inspired by Jesus' words to do just that. The quote is not about theology in this instance, but an influence to behave as in the OP, to put one's life before another's.

 

"Greater love has no one than this, than to lay down one’s life for his friends. . ." —John 15:13